480. Love In the Mix: A Cookbook for Romance Readers, with Leslie Hachtel

[music]

Sarah Wendell: Hello, and welcome to episode number 480 of Smart Podcast, Trashy Books. I’m Sarah Wendell, and joining me today is Leslie Hachtel. Leslie Hachtel and Nikki Brock put together Love in the Mix, a cookbook for romance readers which benefits ProLiteracy. Leslie tells me all about the cookbook, how it came to be, and some of her favorite recipes. We talk about family favorites, family history through food, and as a bonus, I’ve added info about two of my favorite recipes after the interview. Yes, links will be in the show notes; never fear. Over seventy romance authors contributed recipes and stories, and you can find the cookbook in print and digital editions everywhere books are sold! All proceeds benefit ProLiteracy. There’s nothing better than food and reading, right?

Thank you and hello to our Patreon community, who makes this and every episode possible and makes sure every episode gets a transcript.

I have a compliment in this episode, which makes me so happy!

Maya C.: Some of your friends have saved voicemail messages from you just to hear your voice because it’s reassuring and it always makes them feel happy.

If you would like a compliment of your very own, have a look at patreon.com/SmartBitches. 

Now, I want to give you a heads-up about two future episodes of this here show. First, next week is the next recap in my Sweet Dreams Romance Recap series, and I’m talking about The Popularity Plan by Rosemary Vernon. This book is a journey, y’all, and I hope you’ll come along with me on this one. Just bring your memories of awkward dates and awkward conversations.

I love how many of you have emailed and tweeted at me to say how much you loved the first Sweet Dreams Recap. Thank you. It is really reassuring to me because, I mean, I am doing something new, and I love how much you guys love it and how many of you remember that book as well as I do. This is so much fun nostalgia for me, and I’m so happy you’re having a good time.

And then Friday, November 5th, I will be sharing part two of a two-part crossover event! Amanda and I connected with Jeff and Will from the Big Gay Fiction Podcast, and we answered listener questions from both of our Patreon communities. The Big Gay Fiction Podcast will release part one on Thursday, November 4th, so you get all four of us being ridiculous together for two episodes back to back. We have book recs, food discussions, and some thoughtful conversations about genre and community, and I hope you’ll tune in.

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This is a very food-y episode. We talk about a lot of food, so if you’re even the slightest bit hungry you might want to grab a snack, nice beverage. Let’s do this: on with the podcast.

[music]

Leslie Hachtel: My name is Leslie Hachtel, and I write romance novels. I have sixteen published to date, and I’m working on two more.

Sarah: Well, that, that sounds like a really easy workload. Good heavens! How long have you been writing romance?

Leslie: Probably about eight years.

Sarah: That’s a lot of books in eight years!

Leslie: Yeah. [Laughs]

Sarah: Are you one of those –

Leslie: – type A personality.

Sarah: Are your, are you, are you one of those people who’s a pretty quick writer? Once you start you just go?

Leslie: Yes.

Sarah: Yeah?

Leslie: Yeah. I take breaks in between, and then it, like, sort of builds up, and then I sit down and – yeah.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: It goes pretty fast.

Sarah: Yeah, I call that word labor? Like, you don’t get to choose when you go into labor. My brain is just sort of like, listen, I got words. You should write them down now.

Leslie: [Laughs] Yeah, that’s exactly what happens!

Sarah: Yep!

Leslie: I wake up in the morning, it’s like, get to the computer now. Hurry.

Sarah: Yep. Yep, I’ve had that; I, I remember having that in college. I remember being in line for, you know, to pay for my meal or something and having to grab a pen and paper because I had figured out exactly what I wanted to say in a big paper I was working on, and so I had to, like, step out of the line and write on a receipt, and I, and I remember thinking, this is really weird! Really weird that my brain does this!

Leslie: I did that once in the doctor’s office. It came to me and I grabbed something, and I’m writing, and the doctor came in and said, it’s okay, I’ll take the notes.

[Laughter]

Leslie: Okay, no. [Laughs]

Sarah: But I always have to have something to write with for that reason, always –

Leslie: Yeah.

Sarah: – and it’s been true as long as I can remember, having to write things, like, when I was in college.

So you recently released a romance reader cookbook.

Leslie: Yes!

Sarah: This is so cool, because, well, you’ve combined food and reading, which, along with wine, are some of my favorite things, so I am completely in, in support of this project! Please tell me how this cookbook came to be.

Leslie: I was thinking about that, and what happened was, I was taking a shower, which of course I always get my best ideas when I can’t write them down.

Sarah: Always!

Leslie: Right? And I was feeling really grateful. I was feeling, it was, you know, the, it was in April; we’d been through the first year of the pandemic, and I was feeling grateful –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: – because I had so many blessings, and what do you do when you’re, when you feel that is you want to give back.

Sarah: Right.

Leslie: And so what did – so I started to think about what got me through that time of isolation, and reading and cooking! What would I have done if I couldn’t read? So I realized how vitally important that is and what a gift it is to be able to read. And then I was thinking, I mean, cookbook anthologies aren’t new, but romance readers love their authors, so if we could combine that with their recipes, but more, some of their personal stuff. Then, because when you, when you love an author, you want to know more about them. You want to know just things that, that make them who they are, and so I thought, hmm, okay, a cookbook anthology, and what’ll we do with it? Well, let’s do it for ProLiteracy so the people who can’t read will be able to read.

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: So I contacted a friend of mine, ‘cause I realized I couldn’t do it by myself, and her name is Nikki Brock, another author, and she graciously said she would help me, and so we started. First we contacted ProLiteracy, and it turned out the timing was really good, because they were having the Great American Book Sale in September –

Sarah: Ahhh!

Leslie: – and this was, this was like April, so the timeframe was good. So they said, that’d be great! So then we started contacting authors, and we ended up with like seventy-four of them, and I have to say that the authors were fantastic. They are so generous, and the, the, the stories they told in the cookbook are, some of them are so touching, and even the simple ones, you know, like we always have this at holidays or whatever, it, you get a feel for who those people are, which – and for romance readers that means a lot!

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Leslie: So the recipes are good, but the anecdotes are better. So.

Sarah: So each, each recipe in the cookbook is contributed by a romance author and comes with a, a story; not a fictional story, but the context of that recipe: where it comes from, why it’s important, why they picked this one.

Leslie: Right, right. I think there are a couple that don’t have anecdotes, but then if you, but most of the authors contributed two or three recipes –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – so some of the recipes don’t, but if you go back to the author, they have an anecdote somewhere in there with a different recipe. So yeah.

Sarah: That’s really cool! Are you often the friend who has the ideas and then contacts somebody and says, I’ve had this idea? Are you that person?

Leslie: [Laughs] You mean, the old, the old let’s build a barn and put on a show? Yeah, kinda.

Sarah: Yeah, ‘cause I, I also am that friend, and there are people who are like, what are you doing now? Nothing, nothing, nothing! Nothing at all; just wanted to know if you had a few minutes to talk about a crazy idea? And it’s always in the shower, right?

Leslie: Always!

Sarah: Always.

Leslie: Always. So then you go dripping down to someplace, and so you’re dripping when you’re writing it down, you know.

Sarah: Yeah, yeah. Or, or you try desperately to figure out a way to remember it, like, okay, um – like, I, I will often have ideas when I’m walking my dogs, so I’ll put my wedding ring on my index finger and leave it there so that when I get home it’ll be like, why is this on the – oh, that’s on the wrong finger to remind me to –

Leslie: That’s a great idea!

Sarah: Yeah, I move my –

Leslie: That’s a great idea.

Sarah: – I move my wedding ring around, and if it’s a really big idea then I have to put it on my thumb, because that’s super uncomfortable and I’m constantly aware of the fact that it’s on the wrong finger. [Laughs]

Leslie: That’s a great idea!

Sarah: So with this cookbook, I would really love to learn more about it. So you had over seventy authors contribute. Did this just start by you reaching out to the people you knew to reach out to the people they knew? Was this sort of like a, like a big phone tree of food?

Leslie: I would say probably ninety percent of the authors that we reached out to didn’t know who we were and had, had some idea – I mean, they knew we were legitimate –

Sarah: Right.

Leslie: – because you could, could always look us up on Amazon, but we weren’t – you know, some I’d met, some I’d known, but a lot of ‘em just went on faith.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: And that alone –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: You know, it’s sort of like you don’t want to say, I’m stalking you –

[Laughter]

Sarah: No, you, you don’t!

Leslie: – give me your recipes! [Laughs]

Sarah: That’s, that’s not how you generally lead a request, no. [Laughs]

Leslie: I actually did have that once years ago with an author; I had been a judge in a contest, and I went up to her and I said, I, I just want you to know that I loved your book, and she thought I was a fan.

Sarah: Oh no!

Leslie: Like, no, I was one of your judges. [Laughs]

Sarah: Ohhh! Ah! Oh my gosh!

Leslie: It’s still a joke between us.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Leslie: But, but you, I mean, in this day and age, because of the internet and because of the accessibility and stuff, you have to be careful, so. And I, I was surprised that so many of the authors were forthcoming, and we did write, you know, we did reference ProLiteracy –

Sarah: Of course.

Leslie: – we did make a legitimate letter, but even so, how many scams do you get every day? So –

Sarah: And how many requests for your time, or how many requests for, will you contribute to this, or will you read this or blurb that? It’s, there’s a lot, yeah.

Leslie: Yeah. So I was really amazed at how many responded, and I have to say a shout-out to Kristan Higgins, who was the first to send me her recipes. Her daughter was getting married, her son was graduating, she’d just released a new book, and she had those recipes to me with the anecdotes before it hit – I mean, instantly.

Sarah: Wow. Do you remember what recipes she contributed?

Leslie: Yes. [Laughs]

Sarah: What did she contribute?

Leslie: Chocolate chip cookies –

Sarah: Oh!

Leslie: – and – yes – and her sour cream, it was a sour cream, sour cream coffee cake that she had taken to the state fair – this is part of her anecdote – taken to the state fair. She won and then, years later, her daughter won with the same recipe.

Sarah: [Laughs] I, I, I have to say, we are recording this at about ten in the morning, and now I’m going to be really hungry. We’re going to talk about food –

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: – and I’m going to get to be like, I’m going to have to save my files and then go find some coffee cake? [Laughs]

When you sent out the letter to compile the cookbook, did you specifically ask for a story to go with it? How did you make your request? ‘Cause that seems like – I am very much a fan of, all right, run it up the flagpole; see who salutes! Let’s see what happens! You never know if you don’t ask. You know the answer if you, the answer if you don’t ask is always no, right? But also it’s hard to ask for, like, I need a recipe and some time. How did you phrase, and how, how did you frame this request, and what did you ask for?

Leslie: I’m trying to remember the original letter that we sent, but it said basically what I told you in the beginning is that it’s important that we have readers. There’s nothing more important to a writer –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: – than having readers, so we, we sort of, we compiled this letter, and it sort of had that reference and saying that we are compiling this anthology, and  we would love it if you’d send us some recipes, but not just that but an anecdote, and then I gave an example like –

Sarah: Ah.

Leslie: – we have this every Christmas kind of thing –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and we’d love it if you’d consider. And a lot of these people, I did not have their direct emails because they protect them, which I don’t blame them.

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: And so I would message them through Instagram and Facebook, and, and Nikki did the same thing, and say, if you want more information, please email me. Here’s my email address.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: So they could check out who I was and see that it was actually legitimate.

Sarah: I have to say –

Leslie: And of course the reference to ProLiteracy.

Sarah: Of course, of course, and I have to say, I appreciate the, the caution with which you approach people. I get a lot of weird requests and a lot of scams in my inbox too, so I appreciate that you’re sort of aware of the context in which you’re operating, even as you’re trying to put together something is going to raise money for an organization that, if you’re a member of RWA or have been a member of RWA, you’re familiar with ProLiteracy, because the book signing would benefit that same organization.

Leslie: Which, which stopped in about, in 2018 I think was the last one.

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: So it’s been a while –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – since we’ve had that kind of thing. And yes, I was a member.

Sarah: Yeah. And it was a big fundraiser. It was, it was easily five –

Leslie: It was awesome.

Sarah: Yeah, it was five figures every year!

Leslie: It felt great! I mean –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – I was, I signed, I went and signed, and it, you know, all of us, all the authors, we came out of that and it just felt so good.

Sarah: Woohoo! Yeah! It’s a very specific energy when you’re at a charity book signing, too? I remember having attended so many years in a row, and just the, the energy is a different feeling. Like, number one, takes the guilt off. ‘Cause –

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: – I, I mean, all of these wonderful purchases on these signed books that I am buying, and also this thing and this thing and this other book? I’ll buy this – all of that is for charity, sooo –

Leslie: Right! [Laughs]

Sarah: – it’s okay! It’s all good!

Leslie: Right!

Sarah: And same thing with the cookbook; if you buy the cookbook, well, hey, it’s benefitting literacy, and there’s food.

Leslie: Yes, yes! Agreed.

Sarah: So let’s talk food: what are some of your favorite recipes in this collection? I love, by the way, that there is straight up a Jell-O salad recipe?

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: Like, legitimate old-school Jell-O salad? Like, I had a deep moment of nostalgia right there. [Laughs]

Leslie: Yes, it’s like some of them are really complicated and, you know, really long list of ingredients, and some are really, really simple. I can’t, I mean, I love the, the sweets; I have a terrible sweet tooth –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – so some of those cakes, mm, it’s to die for. And of course Kristan’s sour cream coffee cake would have to do that, and I, I like chicken a lot. Chicken gets boring, so finding, there are chicken recipes in there that are different, and I don’t really have any, any favorites per se. I, I’m, I’m, every time I open the cookbook for one reason or another I just get excited.

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. I get it.

Leslie: You know.

Sarah: And it’s also, I know that when I am looking for recipes – like you said, chicken gets boring – when I’m looking for recipes, I really like it when I know that the recipe that I’m reading was picked by somebody else for a reason. Like, it’s not just, here is yet another thing you can do with chicken. Here’s the thing that we love to do with chicken. It’s, it’s like a, a curation and a recommendation, and this is the way we love chicken the most.

Leslie: Right.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: And the family’s done it, and, and my mother had it and my grandmother had it and –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – I don’t know if I make it as – somebody wrote that they weren’t sure it was as good as their mother’s, but they keep trying, and that’s so sweet!

Sarah: [Laughs] I have recipes like that! And when you cook, you’re, you are often making things that you’ve made before or that someone taught you, so much like storytelling is, you know, folklore passed down, recipes are just that same kind of folklore.

Leslie: Right.

Sarah: So effectively you’re combing those two, right?

Leslie: Yes. And that, and again, that, that connects the readers to the authors –

Sarah: Yeah, absolutely.

Leslie: – which is, I mean, I find that really, you know – ‘cause I, I’m a fan!

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Leslie: I’m a fan of a lot of these authors too, and it, it touches my heart that they have these family traditions –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and these family holidays that – one of my favorites is Beverly Jenkins said she, she has a recipe for Mud, which is, it’s called Mud; it’s a sweet dessert, and she said basically – and I’m paraphrasing – that she’d better have it or not show up at the holiday.

Sarah: [Laughs] I have, I have family recipes like that too!

Leslie: Yeah. And I mean, can you imagine turning Beverly Jenkins away? No!

Sarah: No!

Leslie: [Laughs] Right.

Sarah: But if you’re family, you don’t care that she’s Beverly Jenkins; it’s just like, where’s the Mud, ma’am? Where is it?

Leslie: That’s right. Exactly.

Sarah: I need, I need that chocolate!

[Laughter]

Leslie: Exact-, exactly!

Sarah: So a lot of the things with family recipes and family favorites is that they’re often much older recipes, and sometimes you’ll, you’ll come across a recipe for something and you’re like, wait, that’s – why are you putting meat in a Jell-O? I don’t understand! Why?

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: I’ve seen, there’s a, there’s a wonderful TikTok run by a dude who tries old recipes, and either they’re great and he’s horrified or they’re horrible and he’s horrified.

Leslie: Right.

Sarah: So –

Leslie: A lot of them, a lot of the, the, the things that have been passed down, it’s like my husband’s family, they always had rutabagas at Thanksgiving.

Sarah: Huh!

Leslie: Okay, now rutabagas, sorry, they’re pretty disgusting, but it’s a family tradition!

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: So – [laughs]

Sarah: Oh yeah. And it’s funny, even if you don’t like it, you’re going to know that family recipe. Like, you don’t want it –

Leslie: Exactly.

Sarah: – to end with somebody – even if you don’t like it, even if you don’t make it, you want to know that you have it.

Leslie: And it’s, it’s family history; it connects you to, you know, the –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – the whole ancestry thing and the history thing: where have we come from?

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: And food is so much a part of who we are, and, and –

Sarah: Absolutely.

Leslie: – our, our culture.

Sarah: And also it, it, it does that, what you said before, it connects you to authors that you love as a reader and also helps connect you to their family and their, what they do, which, which is an, it’s another form of, of, of connective intimacy through words, too.

Leslie: Yes. Yeah.

Sarah: So what stories grabbed you the most from this, from this anthology? What are some of your favorites?

Leslie: Again, I love Beverly Jenkins. All of them, I can’t really pick any one in particular –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: – necessarily, because they were all personal.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: And that meant so much to me, that they would trust me with this part, an important part of their lives!

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: And trust that it would be done the way they wanted it done, that, that I wouldn’t be editing or – and in fact, the, if you look, and some people commented on this, the fonts are different –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – intentionally.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: Because that’s how they came to me. They came to me in those fonts, and that’s how they went to the formatter, because it’s, it’s theirs, it’s their story –

Sarah: Right.

Leslie: – and, and the fact that they would, again, the generosity was unbelievable. It, these fabulous authors who took their time, and many of them bestselling authors who are so busy. Let’s see, Ella Quinn is, she was, she’s trying to find a place to live, I think in Germany. She’s, like, house-hunting; she’s desperate to find a place to live; she’s got this big dog; all this is going on. She sent me recipes with, you know –

Sarah: Wow.

Leslie: – all of the stories are touching, all of them, and, again, you know, when you have your favorite authors, as you said, it, it connects with an intimacy so that now you’re not reading just a book by someone. You’re reading a book by someone you, you have feeling, a feeling for, a –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Leslie: – a connection with, because they shared that.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: So.

Sarah: And there’s something, there are, there are many different recipes in this cookbook, right? It’s not just sweets. There’s dinner –

Leslie: There’s everything.

Sarah: I mean –

Leslie: Salads and soups and dog biscuits. K. D. Garcia is a veterinarian, so she has liver biscuits for dogs. We have beverages. We have the whole gamut, starting with appetizers, and some of them are – we have one author from Australia who had to put her ingredients in metric and –

Sarah: Imperial, yeah.

Leslie: – and – thank you – and it, it’s like, wait, what? [Laughs] Because that’s how she does it!

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: So that, again, that gives you different perspective. It’s like –

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: Which I love.

Sarah: Absolutely! And there aren’t a lot of cookbooks that include the dogs, right?

Leslie: The dogs?

Sarah: Yeah! There aren’t a lot of cookbooks that include food for the dogs.

Leslie: Yeah, no, and there are two, I think I have two dog recipes, so.

Sarah: Oh, that’s brilliant.

Leslie: And, and, and my dog wants to try them, for sure.

Sarah: I think that you should get on – yeah, definitely need to do that.

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: So now that it is fall and I am cooking more inside – in the summer we grill a lot, but, you know, as it gets colder I take over, I get the Crockpot, I get the Instant Pot. Are there any recipes that you’re really looking forward to?

Leslie: The nice thing about some of it, like the soups and the – it’s, that’s what I love.

Sarah: Yeah?

Leslie: I love to just throw it in the Crockpot and plug it in and then go about my day, and then it’s –

Sarah: Yep!

Leslie: – ready. So there, those are, there are recipes in there, and the, some of them are pretty, as I said, they’re pretty complicated, but some – I mean, I contributed too, and –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – that are, my recipes are really super simple –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – because nobody in my family ever cooked.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Leslie: So if I didn’t learn –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – I would starve! [Laughs]

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: So I learned simple stuff. But then you see these traditions of all these ingredients and all this time –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and it’s so impressive.

Sarah: Oh yeah. So what are some of your favorite Crockpot recipes?

Leslie: I like to do what I call like Garbage Soup? Which sounds delightful, but it’s –

[Laughter]

Leslie: – what I have in the, in the refrigerator, what I have in the pantry, and you just, hmm, green beans would go with that, and –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – I got some meat. Yeah, let’s throw that in there, and wait, this probably would taste good, and, you know, and then you cross your fingers and hope for the best.

Sarah: Yep. I, I have a few recipes like that. When I first moved into an apartment, and like you, I didn’t know a lot about cooking, I did not know very much at all, I found a recipe in a magazine that was basically combining a bunch of canned vegetables with some broth, and it was like carrots and green beans and then the, very specifically the zucchini in a zesty tomato sauce – that added tomatoes – and corn and whatever, and you mix it with a broth, and you have a vegetable soup! I thought I had invented the most amazing meal.

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: Like, did you see? Look at all the vegetables in there! I opened six cans to make this soup, but I felt like I had ruled. ‘Cause, you know, I had, didn’t know anything about cooking! Deeply proud of myself.

Leslie: And cooking is such alchemy. 

Sarah: Isn’t it?

Leslie: It, you take, I mean you take these things and you put them together, and then you get something amazing – or not! But it’s okay; you still had fun doing it.

Sarah: Absolutely. Very true.

Leslie: You know.

Sarah: I think that’s especially true with all of the cooking kits, because people, not only do they get the, the recipe, but everything is portioned out so that you don’t have to worry like, oh, I don’t know how to measure that or I don’t have this ingredient. Nope! You have every specific thing you need.

Leslie: I do have to say that of the authors, I think we contacted like two hundred and fifty authors –

Sarah: Wow!

Leslie: – and one of my favorite responses was from – please don’t be mad at me, Robyn – Robyn Carr, who said, Leslie, I do not cook; I warm.

Sarah: Bless! [Laughs] Um, yeah!

Leslie: So a lot of people don’t cook anymore.

Sarah: It’s true!

[Laughter]

Sarah: I know for me, when I make soups, one of the best things we’ve ever purchased in our life is a, is a freezer, like a big freezer?

Leslie: Yes.

Sarah: So whenever I make a big soup, I always have a serving of it in the freezer. I’ve got spaghetti and meatballs in there, I’ve got all kinds of soups in there, so when it’s, when it’s a night where I’m completely brain-fried, I do like a good warm. A good warm recipe: push button, let go? It’s pretty great. [Laughs]

Leslie: I don’t think she cooked it ahead of time. I just –

Sarah: No, just warm.

[Laughter]

Leslie: But I, I did get a lot of that, that, you know, I, I don’t really cook.

Sarah: I don’t cook! Yeah.

Leslie: But, but those authors, many of those authors would, would respond, but I’ll promote it for you. And I just saw a promotion from Susan Elizabeth Phillips; she’s promoting the cookbook. I mean, stuff like this that you happen to – it’s just so nice that –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – even though they’re not actively participating in the book itself, they’re still promoting –

Sarah: Absolutely.

Leslie: – the book.

Sarah: Definitely. So how is the cookbook doing so far? Are you pleased with the response so far? ‘Cause it just came out!

Leslie: It just came out. We did get some banners on Amazon, and I kept getting – yeah, I know! I can’t, I have list-, we listed the publisher as ProLiteracy, because they were getting all the profits, so I –

Sarah: Oh, that makes sense!

Leslie: – so I can’t access the reports for it.

Sarah: Nooo!

Leslie: But for – [laughs] – I know!

Sarah: Ahhh!

Leslie: It’s not fair! [Laughs more] It’s okay. But I am hearing that we’re doing pretty well.

Sarah: Yay! I mean, come on, the reports board is like an author’s favorite videogame.

Leslie: Exactly. Exactly.

[Laughter]

Leslie: So this is like –

Sarah: What was –

Leslie: – I have to write and ask, how we doing? We’re doing good, we’re doing good, and, you know, so.

Sarah: And I imagine ProLiteracy is very pleased with this idea.

Leslie: We had a great time.

Sarah: Yeah?

Leslie: They were fabulous to work with. Their art department came up with the cover, which I just love. And they’re doing PR, and they’re going to promote it for Christmas presents, because it’ll be – it’s a great Christmas present.

Sarah: Oh, absolutely!

Leslie: They’re, so they’re involved in it in that way, and, but they, they’re supportive and they’re such kind people, you know, and –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and helpful and – it was great. It was, it was a great experience. It was; I loved it.

Sarah: And compiling a book is no small task. Like, it’s a lot of formatting and making sure that things line up correctly. It is not a small job.

Leslie: Yeah, well, first I had to coll-, I collated everything –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and divided it by salads, soups, etc., etc., and then I worked with Judy Fennell, who is fabulous. You know, I, I’ve learned in my life that if something is easy, it’s the right thing. If something is really, really hard constantly, you’re probably going in the wrong direction?

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: And this was really, really easy.

Sarah: Isn’t it lovely when everything just lines up like that?

Leslie: The timing was right; the people were right; it came together. Nikki and I were really worried in the beginning, thinking, oh, what if we only have like five authors come up with –

Sarah: Right!

[Laughter]

Sarah: What if it’s a pamphlet?

Leslie: So, and it, it was the right, it was, it came together great! And –

Sarah: And people love books and food! No one’s saying no to books and food.

Leslie: No, no. Definitely not. And hopefully we’ll have, we’ll have readers now that will be able to read our books because of ProLiteracy!

Sarah: That is a truly excellent thing.

So what are you working on now that the cookbook is done?

Leslie: I’m working on two – I don’t really have a genre. I mean, I, romance, but I, I don’t really have a specific subgenre. I write romantic suspense, and I write historical, historical paranormal, crossover. So right now I’m working on a romantic suspense, which is the second in my Notorious series, and then I had an idea for a time travel.

Sarah: Ooh!

Leslie: For a woman who sees a portrait of a man and, and wants to be with him, only he’s living in the 1500s.

Sarah: As you do.

Leslie: [Laughs] Right! Well, you know.

Sarah: I mean, I have definitely looked at portraits in museums and thought, you’re –

Leslie: Wow.

Sarah: Yeah! Hello!

Leslie: Yep.

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Leslie: [Laughs] Exactly!

Sarah: And I realize that, you know, a portrait in a museum is like the most flattering Instagram filter. Like, those were people portrayed at their absolute best, and they might not have looked like that in real life, but I don’t care! ‘Cause, you know, wow! Hello!

Leslie: But this is romance, so –

Sarah: Yeah, it’s romance.

Leslie: – you, you, you don’t have to worry about, I mean, when you think about what the life was like and –

Sarah: No!

Leslie: Yeah.

Sarah: No, thank you!

Leslie: And the hygiene, and the medical care and all that.

Sarah: Oh, the medical care alone: nope! Nope, nope, nope. That and corsets –

Leslie: Yeah.

Sarah: – no, thank you.

Leslie: Exactly.

Sarah: Yep. I like my elastic-waist pants in the Quarantimes. I just, I just accept this now. [Laughs]

Leslie: Well, they, they’re calling it the COVID 15.

Sarah: Yeah – [grumbles]

Leslie: [Laughs] For the fifteen pounds we gained.

Sarah: I don’t, I don’t, I don’t care how many pounds it was. My body got me through a pandemic; it can have cake. [Laughs] Lots of cake.

Leslie: Right!

Sarah: So I always –

Leslie: And I’ve got recipes for you! For cake.

Sarah: Yes! I, I am aware; I, I have seen and I have bookmarked, and it is a dangerous cookbook; very tempting.

So what books are you reading that you want to tell people about?

Leslie: I read probably three books a week.

Sarah: Yeah, me too!

Leslie: In all genres –

Sarah: Yep!

Leslie: – so I, I read everything. I run the gamut from nonfiction to, I just finished some Tess Gerritsen books. I’m reading now Kelly, Kelly Bowen, just starting that. I’m reading again Julie Garwood.

Sarah: Which Garwood?

Leslie: Heartbreaker.

Sarah: Ooh! Good one. Julie Garwood is some really high-grade nostalgia reading for me? Like, even if I’ve read the book a billion times, it works.

Leslie: Yes. And it’s –

Sarah: And that’s such a talent.

Leslie: And it was strange because I started with her historicals –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – and then all of a sudden it’s like, the suspense and the thrillers, it’s like, what are you doing?!

Sarah: Yep!

Leslie: Oh, okay!

Sarah: It was –

Leslie: I like this! Yeah.

Sarah: It was weird, too. I remember, because I was a historical reader of Garwood, and then also Judith McNaught started writing contemporaries, and Catherine Coulter switched to suspense too! They all sort of pivoted to suspense at the same time, and I’m like, no, no, no, no, no! 1800s! Go on back!

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: I, I like these, these absolutely autocratic, terrible alpha men on horseback. Let’s go back to that, please. I was not a suspense reader. I’ve never been a suspense reader, but I remember they all pivoted at the same time. [Laughs]

Leslie: I can see that, because it, reading those gave me permission to jump subgenres.

Sarah: Absolutely!

Leslie: Well, not that I’m Julie Garwood, obviously, but – [laughs] – someday – but if they could do it, I can do it.

Sarah: Absolutely.

Leslie: So yeah, it’s – but I read so much, and it was, I woke up this morning, I was thinking, okay, wait, that came from which book? ‘Cause I read three in a row, so – [laughs]

Sarah: Yep. I –

Leslie: So that’s –

Sarah: – I know that problem. I spent the weekend reading a series. I – so, half of my family is ready to kick me out of the house for this horrible, heretic decision I have made, but I read book three because I was pretty sure I’d read books one and two, and then I finished three and I was like, I don’t think I read two. So I started two, and then I looked and I was like, when I did read one? Oh, 2018; that’s way back in the day, so I went from three to a piece of two to one, and now I’m back on two, and my family’s horrified by my decisions here.

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: Like, you start with one and then you go through in order; what are you think- – I’m like, no, I read three, I was in the middle of three, I go back to one. Maybe I’ll skip to – they’re like, no. This is unacceptable; I cannot –

Leslie: You can’t do that.

Sarah: This is terrible. So I am very happily ensconced in a series at the moment, and it’s making me very, very happy.

Leslie: It’s so awesome to be able to go there.

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Leslie: To go, to just sort of crawl into those pages –

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: – and go wherever the author takes you; I just love that.

Sarah: Oh, it’s wonderful. And I, I notice that if I don’t have a book that I’m reading and enjoying – like, I tend to do both nonfiction and fiction at the same time, so I’m reading a really weird nonfiction, and I’ll take a break from that and then go back to the fiction, and if I don’t have the fiction to read and let my brain rest in, I get really ornery!

Leslie: [Laughs]

Sarah: Like, I’m unpleasant. I need my books! [Laughs]

Leslie: That’s funny.

Sarah: It’s almost like getting hangry, except it’s books.

Leslie: Book, book, yeah, I get it.

Sarah: Yep.

Leslie: A lot of times what I’ll do then is start research. So right now, because my heroine is going to, is in love with a guy in the 1500s, we need to check that out research-wise –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – so that’s another whole thing of reading. So the thing is, where do I read those books? Do I read them in my office, or do I read them before bed? So –

Sarah: Yeah. Time and place are very important.

Leslie: [Laughs] Yes.

Sarah: So your cookbook, this cookbook is available on all digital platforms.

Leslie: Yes. And, and it’s in paperback, and I, I really think that paperback is the way to go, because it’s something that you want to keep.

Sarah: Oh yeah. I’ve noticed that I have collected a lot of digital recipes, but I’ve started printing them out and assembling them in a three-ring binder for my own, because I’m constantly making notes, and I can’t do that in a digital cookbook as easily as I can, say, you know, this timing is wrong; your oven needs this or whatever. So yeah, I understand. The, the pape- – as much as I read digitally, paper cookbooks are what I tend to lean on when I’m actually cooking, because I, like I said, I write on things, and I make notes, and I stain the pages – that’s another indication I really like that recipe! [Laughs]

Leslie: And I’m hoping that – and I hope the authors will forgive me, but I’m hoping that when people try their recipes they will respond to the authors, whether it be on social media, and say –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – tried your chocolate zucchini recipe; loved it; and –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: Because it would be nice for the readers to give that feedback to the authors, ‘cause let’s face it, we all love praise, you know. We –

[Laughter]

Sarah: And it’s, it’s –

Leslie: Nobody’s going to turn that down.

Sarah: And I know that many readers can feel very bashful or hesitant to reach out to an author. It, I’ve met a lot of people who are sort of, oh, I would never want to say how much I enjoyed the book to the author, but I would like to tell someone else how much I enjoyed the book. Being able to say, hey, made the coffee cake; it was pretty great. That you gives you a, an introduction and a reason to say, hey, thanks, that was awesome.

Leslie: That, that, the celebrity of authors versus the celebrity of, say, TV actors –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and movie actors – TV actors are in your living room –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – and so there’s, you kind of feel like you know ‘em.

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: But authors generally are, are more – what’s the word I want? Secret, private kind of thing, so people, I think, are reluctant –

Sarah: Yes.

Leslie: – to, as you said, reach out to them. So this is an opening –

Sarah: Yeah.

Leslie: – to, to get a little insight into the authors and allow the fans to relate –

Sarah: Yeah!

Leslie: – which is nice, ‘cause as an author, I love when fan, when I hear from fans.

Sarah: And, I mean, who doesn’t love books and food, right?

Leslie: Exactly. Exactly right.

Sarah: Well, thank you so much for doing this interview. Congratulations again on the cookbook!

Leslie: Thank you. Thank you, and let’s just hope that it keeps making money for ProLiteracy so more people can read.

Sarah: Yeah, it’s just not, it’s not a one-time event. It’s, it’s available in perpetuity, yeah?

Leslie: Yes.

Sarah: It’s not a limited-time-only eBook.

Leslie: It is not. It is –

Sarah: Fabulous.

Leslie: – no, it’s available, hopefully if we, we were scheduling it for ten years.

Sarah: Brilliant!

[music]

Sarah: And that brings us to the end of this week’s episode. I will have links in the show notes to where you can find your copy of Love in the Mix. It’s an adorable cookbook; it’s really fun to read.

And as promised, I have two recipes to tell you about, because, well, why not talk about food all the time, right?

First, in the northern hemisphere where I am, it has finally turned into fall, and so all of the Instant Pot and slow cooker recipes that I generally make when it’s cooler are starting to become my number-one crave. First, Instant Pot Ligurian Bean Stew: this recipe is from Hip Pressure Cooking; it is one of my favorites. You have to soak some chickpeas and some white beans overnight, but then you put them in the Instant Pot with some barley, some broth, and then some cloves, which it give it a really interesting flavor, and you cook the heck out of it, and then you top with big shavings of, like, parmesan cheese. It’s so good, and it’s so filling because it’s like, you know, ninety-seven percent beans.

The other recipe that I’m going to link to in the show notes – never fear – is Murder Cookies. They are my favorite. They are from an old recipe on Reddit, but I will tell you, the recipe calls for shortening. Use half shortening and half butter, because the composition, the chemical composition of shortening has changed over the last so many years. There aren’t any baking instructions in the recipe, and – as I link to it – but it’s 350 for roughly twelve minutes. This is easily my favorite fall cookie, and I’ve made them with regular flour, gluten-free blend flour. They’re delicious, and they’re so good with tea or a hot beverage. I’m kind of craving some now; I think I’m going to have to go make some. Oh, the other thing is that it makes an absolute butt-ton, so you can freeze the balls of dough and make fresh batches as you need to. Oh, they’re so good. I need some cookies.

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Before I get to the terrible joke submitted by a listener, because you know those are my very favorite kind, a quick reminder: as I mentioned in the intro, next week is the next Sweet Dreams Romance Recap with The Popularity Plan by Rosemary Vernon, and then Friday, November 5th, is part two of a two-part crossover event where Amanda and I are going to be talking with Jeff and Will from the Big Gay Fiction Podcast. Their episode will come out on November 4th, which is part one, and then we will have part two on November 5th! And I hope you will tune in!

And now, bad joke time, because this is the best part of the show, always! Very, very best part of the show. This joke comes from Chelle. Chelle? Thank you.

What did the grape say when it got crushed?

What did the grape say when it got crushed?

Nothing, it just let out a little wine.

[Laughs] A little whine! I’m picturing this grape going, ohhh! [Laughs more] I love a terrible joke. Thank you, Chelle!

You can always send me bad jokes. Always, please. If you hear one, the first thing you should do is be like, I, excuse me, go email this to Sarah at [email protected].

On behalf of everyone here, thank you so much for listening. It is an honor to spend time with you each week. We wish you the very best of reading and a wonderful weekend.

Smart Podcast, Trashy Books is part of the Frolic Podcast Network. You can find more outstanding podcasts to subscribe to at frolic.media/podcasts.

[lovely music]