442. A 2021 Books Preview with Erin Galloway from Berkley

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Sarah Wendell: Hello, and welcome to episode number 442 of Smart Podcast, Trashy Books. I’m Sarah Wendell from Smart Bitches, and today my guest is Erin Galloway from Berkley! We are going to talk about all the romances that are coming out this year. We’ve got competency porn romance, bodyguards protecting brilliant women, and hilarious mysteries, plus we take a side trip into illustrated cover art and how the appearance of romance has changed. We apologize in advance for the damage to your TBR.

I have a compliment to give in this episode, which is among my favorite things.

To Elesia S.: Archaeologists have discovered several images related to fierce, revered goddesses in ancient societies, all of whom resemble you, your style, and they’re wearing your favorite piece of jewelry!

If you would like a compliment of your own or if you would like to support the show, have a look at patreon.com/SmartBitches. Monthly pledges, which begin with one entire dollar, keep the show going and make sure every episode is accessible to everyone.

I want to say a special hello to Rachel, who is a new patron, who was having an absolutely craptastic week as a teacher in a school that is open and used our last episode to laugh herself back into a better mood. Thank you, Rachel, for joining the Patreon, and thank you for doing what you do. Stay safe and stay golden, ‘kay?

This podcast is brought to you in part by Prose. Now, if you have caught Amanda on our Twitch stream, we’ve talked a lot about her use of the curly girl method to embrace her curly hair – which is gorgeous, by the way – and as my hair has grown out in the Quarantimes, I also realized that it is wavy, which is unheard of. Do I know how to take care of wavy hair and encourage it to do its thing? No. No, I do not. I have been researching products to try, and Prose’s opportunity came at the perfect time. Prose creates custom shampoo and conditioners based on your personal hair analysis and their algorithm. There is an online quiz, and their online quiz dives into every conceivable factor that affects the health of your hair. My particular favorite part was telling it my zip code and then Prose telling me that humidity is a factor in my environment. I live outside DC; yes, it is very humid in the summer. Their algorithm personalizes over fifty billions formula combinations, and they come up with a unique blend of ingredients and products that address my exact concerns! In my case, though, my exact concerns were, what the heck do I do with wavy hair? I am really excited that their products are sustainably sourced, and they’re cruelty free, and they can accommodate any preference, including vegan products, gluten-free, and more! And if I’m not a hundred percent positive Prose is the best hair care I’ve had, they will take the products back, no questions asked. I am going to be trying a shampoo and conditioner, plus a dry shampoo, which I’m very curious about, and if you have wavy hair suggestions, please let me know. If you, like me, are on the what-is-my-hair-doing journey and you want to try Prose, I have a coupon! Prose is the healthy hair regimen with your name all over it! Take their free in-depth hair quiz and get fifteen percent off your first order today. Go to prose.com/TRASHYBOOKS – that’s P-R-O-S-E dot com slash Trashy Books – for your free in-depth hair quiz and fifteen percent off.

I will have links to all, all, all of the books that we talk about in this episode, and I will have links to the episodes and other topics we discuss as well in the show notes, and you know where they are. They’re at smartbitchestrashybooks.com/podcast.

Now, I want to know, what are you looking forward to reading this year? Is there a book that you are thinking, holy smoke, I really want to read that? I’m curious. Let me know: [email protected]. Or you can send me a bad joke, because you know I end every episode with a very bad joke.

I hope this episode gives you lots of new reads to look forward to this year. Having things to look forward to right now is extremely important for me; I presume it is for you too. And if you’re hearing about a book and you think, ooh, I want to try that, you can preorder it or you can request it from your library. And sometimes libraries, if you’re the one who makes the request, will put you at the top of the wait list. Oooh, such power!

So let’s get started with this episode with me and Erin Galloway talking about 2021 books from Berkley.

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Erin Galloway: I am Erin Galloway, the Deputy Director of Publicity for Berkley, an imprint at Penguin Random House, and if you read Berkley books you know us for fantastic commercial fiction. And if you know me, you know that one of my personal favorite genres is romance, so that is what I am here to talk about today!

Sarah: Awesome! So I know that this year has been very weird for promoting books.

Erin: Ohhh, that is putting it mildly!

Sarah: Very, very strange. What are some of the things that have worked really well for you and your team, dealing with trying to announce books this year and get people aware of them?

Erin: Well, in a year like this where everything is clearly a trash fire –

Sarah: [Laughs] Just a little bit.

Erin: Yeah – people are struggling for so many different reasons. I mean, struggling to meet basic needs, number one; struggling, obviously, with mental health, with anxiety, with so many different things.

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: And if your basic needs are met, then probably the things that are causing you fear and anxiety on a daily basis are your health; the health of, you know, your, your loved ones and those you’re close to; and I think when we have all been in a moment like that for eight-plus, you know, close to nine months now –

Sarah: Uh-huh.

Erin: – what do you need? You need something to get your mind off of the everyday horror, to some degree.

Sarah: Yes! So true.

Erin: And –

Sarah: You’re so right about that. I mean, my traffic supports that statement.

Erin: [Laughs] Exactly! So for us as publicists, it was thinking a lot about what books do we have that speak to that experience? That can either, like with horror, let you explore your fear and anxiety in a safe way, or, like, one of the wonderful things about this year is that mysteries are getting a lot of attention, particularly cozy mysteries, because there is a guaranteed ending! You know, the good folks –

Sarah: Right!

Erin: – are going to solve the problem, they are going to win the day, and half the time they’re doing it, like, from an armchair? So the, the stakes aren’t quite so high; it’s very reassuring.

Sarah: The word cozy –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – is in the name.

Erin: Yeah. There’s usually a dog or a cat on the cover; I mean, sometimes some delicious baked goods. So –

Sarah: Mmm.

Erin: – it’s a – I think what we do really well is comfort reads? That’s certainly true in romance, and –

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Erin: – look, if you want to read about someone, you know, escaping and having a, a journey or a life path that you can’t take right now ‘cause you’re legit stuck in your home –

Sarah: Yes!

Erin: – then we have that to offer! And that’s what we kept offering our, our media contacts is, look, if you want to escape, I have a book for you, and it was really interesting. You know, media is very fast-paced; these are all folks that have, you know, very specific deadlines. They’re all working at max capacity from home on computers that are just not to, not meant to handle the amount of Zoom while simultaneously doing emails, chats, composing, you know, various writing, and when we would reach out to these folks, it was really incredible sort of the, the personal touch that mattered a lot this year. I would hear back from media, not even always confirming coverage, but just to say, it’s really nice to hear from you. How are you? Are you okay? Are you in the city? Are you outside of the city? There was very much a we’re-all-in-this-together feeling?

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: And that was unique to this year and also really nice. And I’m fortunate that my books truly are feel-good reads, so when I was –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – reaching out, that’s what I had to share with people, and you know, I think for us, it was just trying to capitalize on what we knew we had to offer –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – and doing it in a way that felt very personal and natural for each of us.

Sarah: Yes! Yes, I know when we were talking earlier, you said something about how you’ve been sending pitch emails saying, well, I’m in my high school bedroom –

Erin: [Laughs] Yeah!

Sarah: – back with my parents!

Erin: Yep.

Sarah: That’s great. So that’s a thing. [Laughs]

Erin: Oh yeah. I just put it all out there. I said, I am literally back in the bedroom that I came home from the hospital and was placed into. I was told by my mother that her house does not come with housekeeping services, and therefore I am to make my bed every single day, no exceptions, and –

Sarah: Oh my gosh!

Erin: – she told me that in the middle of a workday after walking past my bedroom multiple times when the bed was not made, and she came down the hall and was like, you need to go make that bed and you need to do it now! I don’t care what meetings you have; I don’t care what emails you need to send. This is my house; you are living in it; those are the rules. And, you know, that, that’s a pretty low bar for her to have for me.

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: So understandable; I was happy to make the bed. It was just very funny, you know, to have –

Sarah: Right, ‘cause you don’t expect to be like, excuse me from this meeting; I have to go make my bed real quick?

Erin: Yeah, no. I, I was not anticipating that, but –

Sarah: Mm-mm.

Erin: – at the same time, my parents and I really enjoy each other’s company, and –

Sarah: That’s very good.

Erin: I’m so fortunate for that, but it is funny and, you know, I don’t think they ever anticipated I would come home again at this stage in my life and live for a really extended period of time. But we’re counting it as, like, a rare blessing in this pandemic.

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. That you get to be with people who you like being with is, is a definite win.

Erin: Yes. Without a doubt. Absolutely.

Sarah: Definite win.

All right, so I want to know: please tell me about all the awesome books that you have coming in 2021. There are some titles I need to ask you about –

Erin: Sure.

Sarah: – for 2021. In fact, let me move my keyboard into position –

Erin: [Laughs]

Sarah: – so that I can start writing them down and not catch the sound of my keyboard on the microphone.

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: I know you’ve got some titles. You, you sent me one, and you were like, I cried laughing at this.

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: I literally cried laughing.

Erin: Yes!

Sarah: Please tell me all about your books.

Erin: Oh, I’m so excited to share, and, you know, first I have to say we have, obviously, an exhaustive list, so what I’m going to share today is only a fraction of what we have to offer, and we’d be here for hours if I got to talk about every book that I’ve read or loved, so I’m going to try and narrow it down just for the sake of all of you listening, so you only have to hear –

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Erin: – some of me. And I’m going to kind of go in chronological order just to make it easy on everybody.

So the first one that I wanted to mention is The Ex Talk by Rachel Lynn Solomon, and, I mean, it’s perfect because it’s, you know, based on kind of this radio show/podcast idea, and I’m on a podcast, so perfect, perfect!

Sarah: It works!

Erin: It comes out in January, and Rachel is a YA author moving for the first time into adult fiction. And we’ve done this with a couple of different YA authors, certainly as have, you know, other publishers with, with great success, so I’m, I’m really looking forward to this first book from her. And it’s such a fun concept, in that we all know that public radio does struggle to maintain funding, and that is certainly the truth in this book where our hero and heroine are at a public radio station in Seattle, and the heroine is, you know, a long-time producer; she’s really wanting to move up the chain; and she kind of casually tosses out, you know, a way to get more listeners is, wouldn’t it be interesting if they did like a, kind of a dating show with two exes giving dating advice. And it’s a little bit of a shot in the dark, not entirely serious on her part, and she just so –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: Yeah, I mean –

Sarah: But you’ve been meetings, right –

Erin: Mm, oh!

Sarah: – the minute you toss out a random idea, that’s the one and you’re like, wow, I wish I hadn’t said that with my face.

Erin: Yes. Yes.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: I have been there!

Sarah: Isn’t that how meetings always go?

Erin: Absolutely. The thing you toss out as, like, to make yourself laugh is the thing that someone else is like, that’s brilliant! And you’re like, oh no –

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Erin: – that’s not actually –

Sarah: Oh crap.

Erin: – what I wanted to do here. So that’s what happens to her, and she has a very contentious relationship with one of her colleagues, Dominic Yun. He’s a hey, I’m, I-just-graduated-from-Northwestern-and-I’m-really-fabulous attitude going on, or at least that’s how she sees it. So her boss thinks, ooh, here are two people that kind of already have this very sparring, you know, relationship; wouldn’t it be great to put them on the air as exes? Problem: they aren’t actually exes.

Sarah: Uh-oh!

Erin: Yep, they have never dated. But the radio station thinks, ooh, this could really get us some listeners! And of course the radio station is right: it does get them –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – listeners, and –

Sarah: Oh yes.

Erin: – rather quickly. So this gimmick that she tossed out becomes a lie that really does sort of take over her life!

Sarah: So it’s not a fake relationship, it’s a fake former relationship.

Erin: Yes! A fake former relationship –

Sarah: Ah!

Erin: – exactly!

Sarah: Ooh!

Erin: So that’s a fun new twist.

Sarah: Nifty twist!

Erin: And of course they don’t want anyone to know that they’re lying! That would destroy their –

Sarah: Oh –

Erin: – their credibility, and both of them –

Sarah: right.

Erin: – are, you know, they have journalistic integrity. They are not comfortable with this –

Sarah: Yep.

Erin: – but the added layer here is that with the way things are going at the station, it’s pretty clear that people are going to lose jobs in the upcoming months, and this is an opportunity for each of them to stay employed. They have to lie to families, telling their families and friends, oh, we dated quietly; we didn’t make a big deal out of it. You know, and what do you do when this person that you pretend-dated, but not really, and now have to fake it about, you have to go on a couple of real dates to actually get to know each other, ‘cause how on earth are you going to talk about your failed relationship if you don’t know anything about each other, and what happens if, oops, you actually decide that you like the person? What do you do then?

Sarah: Oh my God, what a simple yet compelling twist on a really familiar trope. Eee!

Erin: It is so well executed, and I just loved these characters. I mean, it’s, like you said, it’s a wonderful concept that we all understand instantly –

Sarah: Yep.

Erin: – and the characters really just bring it such life. They’re each so, by turns, like, vulnerable and strong in their own ways, and I was just delighted. So I’m really excited for people to start reading this one.

Sarah: Elyse mentioned that she is reading it now –

Erin: Ooh!

Sarah: – and she says that she’s only a few chapters in, but there is so much competence porn –

Erin: Yes!

Sarah: – in terms of public radio and radio and, and, and at one point she said, like, please explain how being a radio producer works in incredible detail; it is deeply soothing to my brain. So not only do you have the cozy element –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – but you have competence –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – and competence is very sexy and compelling to me, I can say, personally speaking.

Erin: Absolutely!

Sarah: Especially right now! Like, oh you know what you’re doing and you’re doing it on purpose?

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: Tell me, tell me, tell me everything. Tell me more!

Erin: Yes. I really appreciate someone that is competent at their job?

Sarah: Yes!

Erin: And that you don’t have to question will do the job well.

Sarah: Oh. No!

Erin: ‘Cause –

Sarah: I mean, that’s –

Erin: Yeah! Competence is really a, a sort of trust if you think about it, and –

Sarah: Absolutely! I trust you –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – and I rely on you –

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – to do the thing you said you were going to do.

Erin: Yeah, absolutely. And you’re right: this book has it in spades.

Sarah: Awesome!

Erin: So –

Sarah: That’s on, that’s on my Please Read Soon list, might be my Holiday Reading list.

Erin: Ooh, that’s a good one. That’s a good escape.

And another one that is just, it’s, again, such a great concept and delightful, and that is A Lady’s Formula for Love by Elizabeth Everett, and I just can’t get enough of this concept, where it is a secret society of lady scientists, and they create this secret society in – I believe I’m getting it right – Victorian England. I always –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – mess up the ages, so forgive me, Elizabeth, if I got it wrong. But the, the great thing is they’ve created this, you know, supposedly women’s club. It’s kind of like, instead of a gentlemen’s club, you know, like White’s or one of those from back then, this is a ladies’ club. What you don’t know is that once you enter the doors, there are laboratories, and there are women doing experiments and various exciting things behind closed doors. So it’s really interesting, and our heroine, Lady Violet, who presides over the society, and it’s actually her property where the building is, she has been doing, you know, some, some sort of experiments and things in service to the crown –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – and there is the possibility that she is in danger. So a protection officer is hired for her, aka a bodyguard.

Sarah: Oh! Yes? I –

Erin: And, and if you’re –

Sarah: – I see. Yes? Mm-hmm?

Erin: – if you’re seeing bodyguard romance here, you are seeing correctly.

Sarah: Oh! Speaking of competence.

Erin: Oh yes.

Sarah: Man, it’s a core competency: you have to –

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – keep me from not being dead.

Erin: Indeed!

Sarah: Very fundamental competence level for your bodyguard.

Erin: Indeed. And Arthur, like, presents a very stern, very British figure. What I really loved about him, though, like this little bit of humor, is he has been to the States before, and the way he speaks about Americans is hilarious. He finds them –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: – over the top, brash, too much, and, I mean, I am an American, so I know exactly what he means.

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Erin: So it’s just really humorous to get that element. And of course, you know, Lady Violet, competence is very appealing to her, and she has not had, you know, a great history with romantic relationships. She and her late husband believed that they would be a good match, and unfortunately they really weren’t. He swept her away, and as she puts it, the, the things that initially drew them together were exactly the things that did not make the marriage work long term, which –

Sarah: Oh dear.

Erin: – is unfortunate. And he was a bit older, so he’s passed on.

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: And since then, she really hasn’t had any relationships, any dalliances, not even any sparks! So Arthur is quite a shock to her senses in, in every way, and it’s just delightful for her to really notice him as a man and also not really know how to flirt competently? So the way that things come across with her is like, oh! You are very strong! And, and smell very nice! Thank you for rescuing me from the fact that my house was on fire. Like, just very, you know, I just loved the way that they approach one another. And Arthur is trying, you know, very hard to maintain his professional distance, ‘cause you can imagine, as a bodyguard, that is part of your core competency, is not to get emotionally attached to who you’re protecting, and –

Sarah: Or physically attached.

Erin: Or, or physically attached.

Sarah: Should try to avoid that too, yeah.

Erin: Which –

Sarah: That’s –

Erin: – let’s just say Arthur is not successful!

Sarah: Ah, darn!

Erin: [Laughs] It’s fun, there’s some great banter, and who doesn’t want to have a secret society of lady scientists?

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Erin: Doing experiments and occasionally blowing some stuff up. Like, fantastic!

Sarah: And the cover is really cute, too!

Erin: Right? We had such fun with that cover, and they really put some thought into that, ‘cause you can see, like, some of the cute little design elements. Obviously –

Sarah: Yes. The beaker.

Erin: Yes, exactly. The, the art team has a real, a real good time doing our romance covers.

Sarah: Have the illustrated covers really worked for, for the titles that you’ve released this year? ‘Cause I’ve noticed more and more illustrated images with different stylistic differences –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – by genre, but it looks like –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – like, it really looks like the trend is full-on illustrated covers –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – this is what we’re producing now.

Erin: Yes! And they are working well. And I, I suppose that really shouldn’t be a surprise, because everything in terms of cover treatments is cyclical.

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Erin: Of course –

Sarah: – different next year; don’t worry!

Erin: Exactly. I mean, we really, you know, noticed the, the kind of change in coming back to an illustrated cover when we did The Wedding Date –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – you know, now a little over two years ago, which is just wild to think, you know, that it was –

Sarah: Right?

Erin: – just that short time ago. And, you know, we sort of imagined when we did that illustrated cover, like, oh, well, it’s been a while since there have been illustrated covers. Like, that would be interesting; let’s try that again. ‘Cause we did want something that looked different from other romances that we had published or others had published recently –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – and there was such a positive reaction to it that we thought, well, let’s do some more! And then it just kept, sort of became a self-fulfilling prophecy that they became very popular again. And certainly, you know, that’s not just us. There are many other publishers with illustrated covers, and illustrated covers never really left, like, the YA world? But I –

Sarah: No!

Erin: – think of them, you know, kind of like what, probably what was early 2000s, like, chick lit. There were some romances that were illustrated back then.

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: Jennifer Crusie had some; Katie MacAlister even. So it’s not like it’s a brand-new trend, and when people –

Sarah: No!

Erin: – said to me, like, where did this come from? It’s, it just came back! I mean, it’s like ‘80s fashion: it returns –

Sarah: Yeah!

Erin: – every so often, you know, as well, and –

Sarah: Listen, I have given up my Jersey driver’s license, but I do know the public, publishing gospel of Bruce Springsteen, which is that everything dies, and that’s a fact, but everything that dies one day comes back.

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: And, and illustrated covers have been the standard for contemporary romance in the UK for ages and ages and ages.

Erin: Oh yes.

Sarah: I know seeing two covers for books like Sarah Morgan’s book, the US cover has photographs –

Erin: Yep.

Sarah: – the UK cover is illustration.

Erin: Yeah. You’re exactly right. And –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – you know, we try to distinguish to some degree because certain, I think certain elements become very recognizable or, or denote certain connotations. So obviously with historical, you know, you’ll notice that there are a variety of historical covers on the market that if illustrated all have a very kind of silhouette effect, and –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – I mean, I think that that is such a recognizable, almost Pride and Prejudice feel that people really are able to convey exactly what that book is going to be about, simply by –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – that cover trend. So it’s been a lot of fun to pursue this, and, you know, I’m sure our designers are thinking, okay, what are they going to task us with next? But thankfully –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: – they’re a very creative bunch, and they really like challenges, so when we offered them the challenge with The Wedding Date of give us something that feels classic and trendy and different: go! They managed to come up with that! So –

Sarah: For sure!

Erin: – thankfully, they work well in, like, this is the tone I’m looking for; this is the overall style –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – and they somehow make magic out of that.

Sarah: Yes. And cover, cover designers and art directors are fascinating people to listen to –

Erin: Mmm.

Sarah: – because, like we’ve talked about, the cover has to convey a lot in one look.

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: Like, it’s not like it’s, it, it’s – you remember those old, like from way back in your days at Dorchester –

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – the covers that had this sort of prism where the image would sort of move?

Erin: Oh, absolutely. I remember those well!

Sarah: Remember those?

Erin: Yes, I still have some!

Sarah: Yeah, so – yeah! Like, I, they were pr-, that was prismatic or prism style –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – or something. It had a name –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – I don’t remember the name, but you, you don’t get an animated GIF as a cover.

Erin: No!

Sarah: It doesn’t, that doesn’t work.

Erin: No, absolutely not.

Sarah: And that image has to do so much work. It’s really interesting to me to see different reader groups reacting to them?

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: I know Amanda has said a few times when she’s working at Belmont in, in, in Boston –

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – the romance readers who come in and want the trade illustrated covers are not interested in clinch cover –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – mass market.

Erin: Yep.

Sarah: They don’t think it’s the same thing, and I’m –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – fascinated by that. Like, I’m not going to, you know, argue or lecture with a reader; you, you read how you want to read –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – and I get it. That’s a thing that attracts you – and I’m such a digital reader –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – I, I don’t, I don’t see the cover –

Erin: Right.

Sarah: – half the time?

Erin: Of course.

Sarah: Sorry?

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: And if I’m getting an ARC it doesn’t have a cover? So –

Erin: Yep. True.

Sarah: – you know. So, I mean, my perspective is completely unique in this one. It’s fascinating to see how different readers respond to changes in trend!

Erin: It is. And, I mean, one of the things that we really believed when we released The Wedding Date and Helen Hoang’s The Kiss Quotient is that there was, there had always been such a capacity for romance to transcend people that were self-identifying romance readers. I have –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – always believed that romance should expand far beyond the core romance community as we know it today, because these books are fabulous! If you’re listening to this podcast, you already know that; I don’t need to convince you.

Sarah: Yes. We already know what’s inside the package if you say it’s a romance.

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: We already know –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – what we’re getting.

Erin: You’re already going to pick it up.

Sarah:  Does what it says on the box.

Erin and Sarah: Yes.

Erin: So we –

Sarah: Just don’t –

Erin: Yeah!

Sarah: – don’t, don’t change everything about it.

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: It’s not like it’s New Coke.

Erin: Yeah!

Sarah: It doesn’t suck! [Laughs]

Erin: Yes. Well, exactly. And it’s why we tried to come up with a package that was attractive to a reader that didn’t know what romance could be. That only –

Sarah: Exactly, yeah!

Erin: – thinks of romance in maybe the 1980s clinch version, and –

Sarah: Of course!

Erin: – there’s nothing wrong with a classic 1980s clinch cover. I still have some of them in my collection! But I really –

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Erin: – I think that there is this connotation of what’s included in those pages? Instead, it’s okay, well, how can we appeal to you? How do we meet you where you are? And we meet you where you are with a cover that looks fun, escapist, modern, that speaks to your sensibilities, and one of the things we know is that a younger readership, you know, the so-called millennial readership, if you want to call that, is very interested in trade paperback fiction. You know, that’s a, a price point that they’re comfortable with. It’s a size and a very Instagrammable, you know, product.

Sarah: Yes. It’s a visual, it’s a visual –

Erin: Yeah!

Sarah: -accessory. Yeah.

Erin: Absolutely! 

Sarah: A book has a lot of roles there!

Erin: Oh, indeed. We were not unaware of all of those roles in designing those covers, but I, even at our, our wildest dreams, I don’t think we saw the boom that would come, you know, for romance –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: – and this is me having watched multiple rom-, kind of cycles of romance booms in my publishing career –

Sarah: Oh, for sure!

Erin: – and still each one to some degree catches me a little bit by surprise, because I know what I love, and I kind of know what I start to hear –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – you know, in, in the chatter in our community and in the right spheres, but it’s really when it hits that critical tipping point and becomes a zeitgeist moment, that is what’s exciting, and you can hope for it, you can pray for it, you can try and prepare for it, but there is just that little piece of indefinable magic that comes along –

Sarah: Oh, for sure.

Erin: – every so often, and it’s all these things converging at once. It’s the fact that finally Netflix realized that you can do smart, sassy rom-coms –

Sarah: Oh yeah!

Erin: – and you can sometimes base them on books! And all –

Sarah: Such a good point.

Erin: – you know, all the sudden, that was coming in at the time, you know, that we were launching Jasmine and Helen, and pretty soon we were off to the races, you know, as were many, many authors, you know, as well. So I, I don’t take away from any of them either, because there are so many other fabulous authors that were already publishing –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – and were able to capitalize on the fact that suddenly everyone was noticing rom-coms! And –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – you know, thank goodness, because fantastic contemporary romance has been around for a long, long time, and now finally folks that, you know, maybe thought, I’m not a romance reader, they’re discovering they are! And that’s what’s wonderful!

Sarah: Absolutely!

[music]

Sarah: Erin and I will be right back with more books that you want to listen to or read in 2021 and discussions of how cover art comes to be, but I wanted to take a quick break to tell you about something very special that Amanda and I are doing. If you’ve ever wanted to listen to us do a live show or you’re one of the listeners who tries to talk to us when you’re listening – I know you’re out there, and I do that too – heads up: I have something extra more fun. Starting on Tuesday, February 2nd, and over the next few weeks, Amanda and I are going to be hosting an after-party live show Tuesday evenings at 7:30 Eastern on Stereo. Stereo is a free live broadcast platform that allows us to talk to you in real time, but through avatars, so neither of us have to brush our hair or put on makeup! We’re going to host a live conversation Tuesday night, 7:30 Eastern on the Stereo app. You’ll be able to listen to us and record messages for us to play during the conversations. We’re going to do random silly trivia, we’re going to discuss the essentials of good Quarantimes sweatpants, and of course we’re going to talk about food and books. And probably recommending drinks. And we want to hear from you so you can be part of the fun! All you need to do is download the free Stereo app and select Smart Bitches so you can connect with us when we’re live. There is a whole avatar building component that Amanda and I had way too much fun with. Just go to stereo.com/smartbitches to get started, and stay tuned for more ways to engage with us on Stereo at the end of this episode. That’s stereo.com/smartbitches.

Now, back to the show.

[music]

Sarah: So when you’re doing cover development, is there a sort of a, a moment where you’re like, okay, how’s this cover going to look with the overhead shot flat lay with the fuzzy socks pulled up to the knee and the big fluff blanket? Is this a fluff blanket cover, or is this more of a hardscape window steamy cup of something cover? Like, do you guys think about it in terms of Instagram and Bookstagram?

Erin: Not every single time. You’d make yourself crazy if you did.

Sarah: [Laughs] Yeah! For sure, yeah.

Erin: But there was absolutely a moment when we did The Kiss Quotient cover that we decided, oh, that background has to pop. That background –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – has to be a strong pop background. And we tried multiple –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – backgrounds out for that cover, and when we got to teal it was as if everyone said, oh –

Sarah: Oh!

Erin: – oh duh! Why didn’t we do that from the beginning? You know?

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: Because the other colors were beautiful and looked, you know, gorgeous, but that teal, you know, that has an iconic feel to it now, and we all got that little, I call it the little tingle, where you just sort of know. Like, there’s something here, and, and, you know, the rest is history.

Sarah: So what other books do you want to mention, my friend?

Erin: Yeah. All right, so this next one, probably everybody has heard me talk about the fact that I love romantic suspense, so, Sarah, apologies, ‘cause there’s always –

Sarah: No, that’s okay!

Erin: – people in jeopardy in romantic suspense, but I have to mention Laura Griffin’s Flight. I have read Laura for many years, and she only just came to Berkley this – well, joined us this past year, but we, we really just started publishing her this year, and I love procedurals. Really love, like, police procedurals, and when there’s, like, a little bit of a love story? Even better! So I’m a long-time fan of Laura’s. I like that she always incorporates investigators, often journalists, and this particular one is really fun. It’s set in a small Texas seaside town. You have a forensic photographer who is very burned out, and you can understand why, you know, if you think about crime scenes and what you have to photograph, and in her tenure as a crime scene, you know, photographer, it, it got to be a lot, and she really needs a break. So she’s in this beautiful little seaside town. She’s contracted to do some, you know, beautiful nature photography, and she’s out one day getting some very early morning shots of birds and comes across a boat that isn’t moving, and she sees something in it, and it’s a couple – a couple that is now dead.

Sarah: Uh-oh!

Erin: And, you know –

Sarah: That is a suspense, after all.

Erin: It is a suspense. And so she does what I, I think really is instinct: she starts taking photographs, because she’s the very first person there; she knows what needs to be done. She takes the photographs, but she is very shaken. Returns to shore, does not have her phone with her, but asks for some, a local’s help to contact the authorities, and when the local detective arrives and he starts interviewing her he gets the sense that, like, she knows a little bit more than she’s saying, and he’s not sure why until later that day when he finds out, oh! She took a whole bunch of photographs that are real good, way better than our own crime scene photographer took photographs, and shared them, you know, with –

Sarah: Ooh.

Erin: – you know, his office to say, like, I know that you’re going to need this. Here’s some things that I picked up, you know, or noticed, I should say; here’s some things that she noticed when she took the photographs. So if you were guessing that the detective’s very intrigued by this lady, you are correct, and obviously they start investigating this crime together. You know, there’s folks in jeopardy; there’s trying to figure out, you know, why would this beautiful, young couple who seemingly had everything going for them suddenly wind up, you know, murdered in a boat kind of in the middle of nowhere. So it’s a lot of fun. Laura does – I mean, I know that’s a strange thing to say on a murder book, but it is a lot of fun, and the relationship is wonderful. There is a fantastic dog – and the dog is still alive at the end of the book, Sarah; don’t worry.

Sarah: Thank you! I appreciate the reassurance!

Erin: You’re welcome. And I’ve really, I love Laura’s procedurals, so if you’re into procedurals, I highly recommend, and it is the first in another series that we have with her. So –

Sarah: I have to tell you, I have been rereading like one and a half books a day, rereading the entire fucking Psy-Changeling series. And those are –

Erin: Oh yes!

Sarah: – procedurals.

Erin: Mm-hmm!

Sarah: I mean, they’re shifter procedurals, but they’re procedurals –

Erin: Yeah. Yeah.

Sarah: – and they’re fantasy, and they’re suspense.

Erin: Yes. Yes

Sarah: And there’s a lot of sexytimes –

Erin: Ohhh!

Sarah: – and I’m like, wow, looking at these from a different – and, and I’ll be honest with you: when I reread Nalini and I get to the violence parts I just start to skim, ‘cause she, she –

Erin: That’s okay; no shame.

Sarah: – she murders some people.

Erin: Yes, she does.

Sarah: There’s murdering; it happens –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – there’s murdering that goes on there.

Erin: Indeed. Always deserved.

Sarah: Oh yeah! It, it’s not, it’s not like a question; it’s like, oh, do I want to put that in my brain? No, I’ll just skip ahead a little bit.

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: So I get it! The, the –

Erin: Yeah.

Sarah: – attraction of the bad people are going to get shut down –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – in these delightfully gruesome ways is –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – very reassuring. I can see why mysteries and suspense –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – are really popular right now!

Erin: Absolutely! And, you know, I think that’s why I like Laura, ‘cause you know you’re going to get a guaranteed happy ending. You know that the good folks are going to save the day, solve the mystery.

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: It is incredibly satisfying. And for a, a completion-oriented person like myself, I really like that guarantee that they are going to competently solve this case, and there will be justice.

I think probably I have talked about it, maybe on here or certainly quite a bit publicly, how much I loved our novel Ayesha at Last by Uzma Jalaluddin, two years ago now, I believe? And –

Sarah: Mm-hmm!

Erin: – she has another book coming out with us: Hana Khan Carries On. Whereas –

Sarah: That’s –

Erin: Right?!

Sarah: – such a good title!

Erin: Isn’t that great? And whereas last time it was very reminiscent of Pride and Prejudice, this time she really gives the story a You’ve Got Mail vibe?

Sarah: [Gasps]

Erin: Which is a lot of fun. There are competing, you know, halal restaurants where our heroine is the daughter of a wonderful chef who has owned her restaurant in Toronto for fifteen years, and, you know, the restaurant has seen better days. The family has had its share of hardships and burdens, and their little community, they have really been able to rely on to, you know, patronize their establishment for years. Well, who comes to town but a new investor who wants to launch his own halal restaurant very close to theirs, and it has all the splash and flash a new restaurant has when it comes in. Lots of investing behind it, and it is a father and son who are opening it, and, well, let’s just say that the son makes some mistakes in how he approaches Hana.

Sarah: Oh!

Erin: Mm-hmm. He, he offers some unsolicited advice on how she and her mom could improve said restaurant and what will happen if they don’t.

Sarah: This fucking guy.

Erin: Yep!

Sarah: Oh God.

Erin: Just not wise, especially when he develops quite an attraction to Hana and really struggles when, you know, he’s really falling for her, and what do you do when you have alienated her so completely? And running parallel to this, Hana’s real passion is not serving in her mother’s restaurant. That is a requirement because she is a member of the family, but her –

Sarah: Uh-oh!

Erin: – her real passion is radio! And in order to sort of develop her skills and really share, you know, about her life as a –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – Canadian-Muslim woman, she decides to launch her own podcast, and she does so anonymously. She really talks about issues that important to her: things about family and the secrets that we share and what those secrets reveal about us and others. She’s talking about, you know, her life and things that matter to her, and she starts to get, you know, regular communication from one of her early listeners, Stanley P. Or at least that’s the name –

Sarah: Of course.

Erin: – he goes by online. And –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – she and Stanley develop a, a very close, you know, texting back, or messaging back and forth relationship, and, you know, she starts to wonder, who, who is Stanley? And Stanley’s wondering who she is, and while they agree that they will not share any information, identifying information about themselves –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – you can all probably guess –

Sarah: Oh, we all know how that turns out.

Erin: – may be, and it is great fun to see these two really begin a courtship process in a very unique way, and if you love descriptions of really delicious food, then read this book with the warning that you want food nearby –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: – because I was hungry –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – from start to finish.

Sarah: I love some good food porn to go with my competence porn?

Erin: Yes. Indeed.

Sarah: That’s awesome.

Erin: And I, I will also say that if you are really appreciative of, you know, an exploration of a community by a member of that community, that’s what you’re getting from Uzma, and she touches on a lot of different things, you know: family complexities, how family heals when it goes through tragedy, and also an exploration of what the immigrant family experience is like, the, the good, the bad, and the very ugly. So I really appreciated all those facets being shown in a sympathetic and honest way in this book.

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: So highly recommend Uzma.

Sarah: Awesome!

Erin: Yes! And then, oh, and I would be remiss if I did not talk about Rosie Danan. So probably a lot of you know Rosie from her fantastic book The Roommate, and the concept of that book is still one of the most fun to me: take a Connecticut blue blood, bring her out to California, thinking she’s moving in with her childhood crush. Oops! His band gets a gig and he leaves, and he leaves her with a subletter, real sexy subletter. So sexy –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – that he is a porn star.

Sarah: Yep! Yeah! Mm-hmm, yep.

Erin: Good, good times –

Sarah: There has been  –

Erin: – are had by all.

Sarah: – sooo much discussion internally among the Smart Bitches reviewers. So much discussion about this book.

Erin: I am certain there is a lot to discuss in that novel. And one of the things that I loved about that book was, you know, this exploration of, you know, kind of feminism to some degree and women’s agency, owning your sexuality, what that means, and I really loved that Rosie subverted the sort of expected in having the ex-girlfriend of our hero in book one be such a fantastic character, not at all a, a jealous character of the hero’s relationship with this new love in his life.

Sarah: Right.

Erin: She, she does give him some smacks upside the head when she thinks he needs them, but she is a really –

Sarah: They have a healthy relationship!

Erin: Yes!

Sarah: Yeah!

Erin: Very much so! And I really was compelled by her story and wanted to see what would happen with her. Well, what happens is that she meets a very handsome rabbi in The Intimacy Experiment. So, Sarah, I will admit, I did bring this up knowing that there was a sexy rabbi just for you.

Sarah: I’m, I, I, I’m intrigued, yes?

Erin: So our, our heroine Naomi is really interested in taking seriously the fact that she wants to be an educator, ‘cause she really thinks that that’s what she has to offer the world: I can offer education on, on sex, you know, sex, sexuality, intimacy.

Sarah: Yeah!

Erin: But it is difficult for someone with her resume –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – to be accepted in academic circles. So she winds up at this conference and gets an incredibly unexpected offer to be a guest lecturer at a temple, and that is not what she is expecting!

Sarah: Nooo!

Erin: And she is not expecting this, you know, too-hot-to-be-true rabbi, and so when she really takes his offer seriously and thinks, well, maybe this is my opportunity to do a guest lecture series and –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – to really show what I have to offer, they develop this syllabus on modern intimacy, and as she begins to offer this course, which, as you can imagine, is populated by wonderful and quirky people from the temple –

Sarah: Of course.

Erin: – well, you have our hot rabbi and our guest lecturer also start following, so, following this syllabus themselves.

Sarah: Ohhh nice!

Erin: Yes, it is –

Sarah: Very nice.

Erin: – it’s great fun, and again, Rosie subverts a lot of the things that one would expect in a book like this, but really this, this exploration of what real intimacy is and how critical faith, honesty, and vulnerability are –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – in developing actual, you know, real-life intimacy –

Sarah: For sure.

Erin: – particularly for a woman that knows how her body works, she knows what she can, you know, use her body for, and –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – she’s uninterested in using her body to get where she needs to go. She built a career on that –

Sarah: Right.

Erin: – very successfully –

Sarah: Yep.

Erin: – and with no shame –

Sarah: But that’s not where she’s going now.

Erin: Yeah, yeah. That’s where she’s been, and where she’s going is somewhere different. And to see someone that has such strong walls start to, you know, little kind of unbuilding blocks, bring those down is a, it’s a very satisfying read.

Plus, I think those covers are also really fun. We tried to do something a little different with those covers to differentiate them from, you know, from other books that we have published. I, I think we say that with every single cover that we do, and obviously the challenge is how do you set every single one apart? It makes me very glad I am a publicist and not a designer.

Sarah: Yes! Yeah, you’re going to run out of colors for the backgrounds eventually.

Erin: I know; I think that all the time. I am very grateful that is someone else’s day job and not mine.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: And I’ll, I’ll try and keep the next couple brief, because I know we only have so much time, but if there are any Beth O’Leary fans out there –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – fans of The Flatshare, then I recommend our upcoming The Road Trip by Beth, and this is great fun because you have two exes who were deeply in love, broke up two years ago, have not spoken since, and –

Sarah: Uh-oh!

Erin: – well, they have a little car accident on the way to a mutual friend’s wedding in rural Scotland.

Sarah: Uh-oh!

Erin: So what happens is only one car makes it successfully out of that accident, and they’ve all got to pile into that car. So you’ve got –

Sarah: Oh!

Erin: Oh yeah.

Sarah: Oh!

Erin: You’ve got the exes, you’ve got the hero’s best friend, you’ve got the heroine’s sister, and a random guy from Facebook that said he could use a ride. So imagine them crammed into a, you know, little Mini car. ‘Cause it’s the UK. Good –

Sarah: Awesome. And those cars –

Erin: Yes.

Sarah: – are little itty-bitty too.

Erin: Indeed.

Sarah: I mean, that’s a serious forced proximity.

Erin: Oh yeah.

Sarah: Those are some itty-bitty cars.

Erin: Oh yeah. And while literally crammed together like sardines, our hero and heroine, Dylan and Addie, really have to confront what, what separated them, what really drove them apart, and was their final decision to end that relationship the right one? So there’s, there’s everything. There is humor, there’s banter, there’s a road trip, there is this – obviously more eventful than any road trip I’ve ever been on – and there’s, you know, a really compelling romance and lots of Britishisms, so it is most enjoyable.

Sarah: Always fun.

Erin: I highly recommend.

Sarah: Fabulous!

Erin: Yes. And I have been putting you off on the book that made me laugh until I cried, so I have to tell you.

Sarah: I no-, I did notice that –

Erin: I –

Sarah: I did notice that I, I –

Erin: – wanted to be sure that I had time to properly gush.

Sarah: Okay.

Erin: So this book is – I should start by saying that I think this book melds the best of a fast-paced mystery caper with, you know, the charm of a rom-com and the poignancy of women’s fiction, so that is a bit of a genre-buster. That’s a lot of things happening in one book.

Sarah: It is, for sure!

Erin: It is called Dial A for Aunties by Jesse Q. Sutanto –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – and it is also Crazy Rich Asians meets Weekend at Bernie’s. And –

Sarah: Oh my!

Erin: – if you think that sounds bananas and bonkers, it is! In –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: – in all the best ways! You have our, our charming heroine Meddy, who is in a wedding business with her mom and aunties, and at the request of her family she goes out on this blind date, reluctantly, and oops! She kills her blind date. Well, you know, I guess it happens. What are you going to do? So she calls her ma and aunties and is like, okay, what, what do we do? What do we do with this dead body? Well, they come up with a plan, but things don’t go according to that plan. That body –

Sarah: No, they never do.

Erin: – is accidentally shipped in a cooler to the billionaire’s wedding that they’re working on that weekend.

Sarah: Of course! Of course they did!

Erin: No.

Sarah: Yeah, absolutely.

Erin: As, as happens. So –

Sarah: Mm-hmm, as you do.

Erin: – there she, her mom, and aunties are, running around the resort, carting the dead body around, trying to figure out how to successfully get it away from the resort, and who does she run into but her lost college love?

Sarah: Oh, of course!

Erin: Obviously he’s there on the craziest day of her life –

Sarah: Of course.

Erin: – at the most important wedding of her career. So she’s got to figure out how to avoid getting arrested because of the dead body, how to win back the love of her life, and how to make sure her ma and aunties, like, don’t mess everything up with their bajillion disagreements.

Sarah: Of course!

Erin: It –

Sarah: Piece of cake.

Erin: I mean, I read this, and I literally laughed until tears were rolling down my face and my family came and checked on me because they needed to know what was happening.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Erin: I remember the editor, Cindy, calling me, and she said, I’ve got this book, and you have to read it. And whenever Cindy says that, I know. I mean, I just know that I am in for a real treat, and from page one, I was like, oh, this is incredible! And I fell so deeply in love that I was texting Cindy that night. Like, this line! This thing that happened! You, do anything you can to acquire this book. And I was so thrilled when we won the auction for this book. I mean, I would have done anything to get this book, and then once we had it, I mean, I was willing to fight off any comer to be the publicist on this book. No one else was allowed to work on it. I mean, they could work on it with me, but I had to be on the book. So thankfully, you know, my, my boss understood that it was in his best interest to allow me –

Sarah: Yeah, just get out of the way.

Erin: – to work on this campaign, and I’m just so excited for people to read this book, because it’s the book that kind of broke my pandemic block. I think all of us have struggled with reading blocks, TV blocks, you know, every kind of block you could have during this pandemic, we’ve all had. And I needed a book that would really let me escape, make me laugh, completely take me out of what was happening on a day-to-day basis, and that book –

Sarah: Yeah.

Erin: – did all of that. And the author calls it a love story to her family, because she’s like, you think this book is nuts? You haven’t met my family! And the book is about a Chinese-Indonesian family – the author is Chinese-Indonesian – and she, she has a lot of experience with weddings! She was a wedding photographer, and she was explaining to me that culturally it’s very normal, you know, for Chinese-Indonesian families to have these massive weddings, and –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Erin: – it’s considered rather shameful in her family that she only had fifteen hundred people at hers. Sarah –

Sarah: I don’t even know fifteen hundred people!

Erin: Same, same. I mean, but she had to use the small ballroom. So I have really enjoyed this book from start to finish, and I’m, I’m just over the moon for people to, you know, finally read it next year.

Sarah: Well, thank you so much –

Erin: Of course!

Sarah: – for giving me the rundown of what people should be looking forward to next year.

Erin: Of course!

Sarah: It’s nice to know there’s going to be a new year and that we have things to do.

Erin: Tell me about it! And, and that’s, I mean, that was really just my preview into June, so stay tuned, folks –

Sarah: Oh man!

Erin: – because –

Sarah: There’s more!

Erin: – we’ve got a whole lot coming, and I’ll just, I’ll just drop this little tidbit – I will tell you more about it later, but I have to say Payback’s a Witch, coming this fall, just two words: queer witches.

Sarah: Oh! Hello, yes?

Erin: It is such a good time. It is such a good time.

Sarah: Lady, lady, lady, ladies loving ladies? Queer witches?

Erin: Oh, you got it! You got it! Two, two ladies who are rather irritated with the man that cheated on both of them and is just, you know, an all-around jerk, they decide to form a little pact with another woman that is a friend of theirs and get back at this guy, and –

Sarah: Oh!

Erin: – in the course of magically – literally magically, ‘cause they’re witches – getting back at him, two of the ladies fall in love, and –

Sarah: Oh no!

Erin: – it’s, oh! So much fun, so much banter, so many good times in a town that is essentially a magical Stars Hollow.

Sarah: Oh my!

Erin: Yep.

Sarah: That’s nice.

Erin: Yeah. Lana Harper does it right in this one, so I, I will be happy to share more as we get a little closer to next fall, but just put that on the list of things that you ought to keep an eye out for.

Sarah: I will keep that in mind.

[music]

Sarah: And that brings us to the end of this week’s episode. Thank you to Erin for hanging out with me. Yes, I will link to all of the books that we talked about if they’re available yet – they might not all be available online – and maybe we’ll have Erin come back and talk about the rest of 2021, because we always need more books to read, right?

As I mentioned, Amanda and I are going to be hosting an after-party live podcast Tuesday evenings, 7:30, on Stereo, beginning February 2nd. Just go to stereo.com/smartbitches to get started. The Stereo app allows us to bring you extra live content. We can interact with you during the show and provide a little extra mayhem and silliness in your week. Stereo can be downloaded for free by Apple and Android users, and once you download the app, you get to create your own avatar and profile, and the avatar creation process is very fun and took me way too long. You’ll be able to submit audio messages to join in our conversation. So like I said, if you’ve ever caught yourself trying to talk to us while listening to the show, now you can interact with us live! We’re going to do trivia, Q & A, debates, we’re going to recommend books, and we’re probably going to talk about more bonkers novellas we’re reading because that’s a lot of fun. We may even do a live Stereo book club episode! So remember, Tuesday nights, 7:30 Eastern, stereo.com/smartbitches. That’s Tuesdays at 7:30 p.m. Eastern, stereo.com/smartbitches.

Hello again and thank you to the Patreon community for making this and every episode possible. I cannot tell you how much I appreciate your support.

And as always, I end the episode with a truly bad joke. This is really bad. I even told this to my family, and the reaction was ewww, so get ready. You ready? I know you’re ready.

How do you get a computer drunk?

How do you get your computer drunk?

Screen shots.

[Laughs] It’s, it’s just so bad! Screen shots. Now I want to know if there’s a cocktail called the Screen Shot; I bet there is, right? I’m sure there is.

On behalf of everyone here, thank you for joining us for this episode. We’ll be back next week, and next week’s episode will include a special audiobook preview of a new Erica Ridley historical romance, so you get a little bonus audiobook joy at the end, and we’ll be back with more fun mayhem and silliness Tuesday nights at 7:30 Eastern on stereo.com/smartbitches.

Until then, have a great weekend, and we wish you the very best of reading.

Smart Podcast, Trashy Books is part of the Frolic Podcast Network. You can find more outstanding podcasts to subscribe to at frolic.media/podcasts.

[groovy music]