534. Spooky Season Cover Snark

[music]

Sarah Wendell: Hello and welcome to episode number 534 of Smart Podcast, Trashy Books. It is time for spooky season Cover Snark! We have got crimes against Tom Hardy. We have questionable titles. We have so much visual silliness! There’s background barking of support from Zeb. It’s just mayhem.

I want to thank David T. Cole from many, many podcasts that I listen to for helping me figure out how to add images. You should – fingers crossed! – be able to see the covers on your screen when we talk about them. If this feature works, please let me know, ‘cause I’m really excited to try this. I hope it works; I really hope it works.

I also want to say hello and welcome – hi! – to our newest Patreon members, Kathryn, Nickie, Rachel, and Roxana. Thank you so much for joining the Patreon, and hello to everyone in the Smart Podcast Patreon Discord! Yay! We are hanging out, we’re sharing recipes, we’re sharing book recs, and we’re sharing pictures of our pets, because what else is the internet for?

If you want to join us, come have a look at our podcast Patreon at patreon.com/SmartBitches. Every pledge keeps the show going and makes sure that every episode has a transcript – hello, garlicknitter! [Hello, Sarah! Hello, patrons! – gk] Monthly pledges start at one dollar a month. Thank you again to the Patreon community for keeping me going each week!

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All right, are you ready for Cover Snark? Spooooky Cover Snark? Let’s do this. On with the podcast.

[music]

Sarah: I have a Wait…, and then I have I Love the Title, But…, then I have the actual cover I brought to snark, so technically, I have –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – two runners-up and a winner.

Amanda: Of course.

Sarah: Yeah, ‘cause I can’t make –

Amanda: I – yeah.

Sarah: – I can’t, I can’t, I can’t ignore all the covers wishing for my attention, ‘cause some of these are like, what?!

Amanda: I call this one Crimes Against Tom Hardy.

Sarah: Oh no! Oh dear God!

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: Oh! Wow. I think that is Tom Hardy!

Amanda: Right?!

Sarah: How come only half of – okay, I have a couple of questions. All right.

Amanda: Yeah, it could be Halloween-themed, ‘cause there’s a lot of orange on this cover, for sure.

Sarah: This is very pumpkin. There’s a lot of pumpkin shades here.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Okay, let me try to describe this. Okay. So half of the background is blue and space, and half of the background is orange and space?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: A person who looks remarkably like Tom Hardy –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – only with yellow cats’ eyes, has long red-orange hair, and I would go so far as to say that some conditioner might be a good idea –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – for some of the hair; it looks a little tangle-y. And then there’s, there’s, like, metal things on his, framing his head like two halves of a heart on either side, plus some shoulder armor –

Amanda: On one shoulder. That’s –

Sarah: – on one shoulder.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: But half of the guy, like one arm, one shoulder, one pec, and a little bit of ab is orange and hairy?

Amanda: Yes.

Sarah: And the other half is black and white human skin with no hair, so it looks like half of a wax has happened here, or this person is half shifter, but the title is My Alien Manumitter. What the fuck is a manumitter?

Amanda: I don’t know.

Sarah: Manumitter: someone who frees others from bondage.

Amanda: Oh! That’s a word –

Sarah: An emancipator from slavery or someone who manumits. Thanks very much for that definition.

Amanda: We learned a new word today!

Sarah: What is a manumitter? Well, someone who manumits! All right, so what is this person manumitting? Wait, are they manumitting themselves, because half of them is hairy and half of them, and they’re, like, freeing themselves? Is that why the shoulder armor is, is shattering, kind of?

Amanda: I don’t – look –

Sarah: Wow. What made you pick this cover? Was there one particular element, or was it just everything?

Amanda: It was just like, wow, there’s a lot going on here.

Sarah: [Laughs] This is a lot happening in this cover; what the hell?

Amanda: There’s a lot going on.

Sarah: Wow.

Amanda: Why would they use Tom Hardy?

Sarah: Right.

Amanda: He’s got, like, things looking like they’re going to poke his eyeballs out. A, like, weird, like, helmet sort of contraption.

Sarah: I mean, those –

Amanda: Also something about, like, the hands? I know he’s, like, holding his own hands, but they don’t even look like they belong to the same person?

Sarah: No, one of them has got claws and fur?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Are they a shifter too?

Amanda: I think they are. It’s just, a lot’s going on, and I –

Sarah: Wow.

Amanda: – feel so bad. Does Tom Hardy know his likeness is being used like this?

Sarah: It really does look like Tom Hardy!

Amanda: Right?!

Sarah: Like, a lot a lot. I, I also question the efficacy of this facial armor. Like, what’s it supposed to do? Because for me that just looks like an eye injury waiting to happen. There’s two points pointing down at the bridge of his nose!

Amanda: Yeah, it’s not like a helmet!

Sarah: If he – no! – if he sneezes, he’s fucked!

Amanda: Ooh, yeah.

Sarah: That’s a bad sneeze face armor.

Amanda: And then just armor on one shoulder.

Sarah: Always the armor on one shoulder or one arm and just, like, nips blasting for aliens.

Amanda: Yeah, and maybe, maybe he’s wearing like an armored belt of some sort? I can barely see it, but –

Sarah: Oh, I just noticed that! There’s some sort of metal filigree over his belly.

Amanda: Yeah. Like a cummerbund! A metal cummerbund.

Sarah: Or he’s trapped in a fence and that’s what he needs to be manumitted from.

Amanda: Maybe! But that is –

Sarah: Wow.

Amanda: There’s just a lot.

Sarah: There is a lot!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: I’ve got to wonder at the use of the word manumitter. Like –

Amanda: I’ve never heard that word before.

Sarah: No. There’s a lot to gaze upon.

Amanda: Yes.

Sarah: I do have to say, I am impressed that the background of the exploding orange planet and his body fur match?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: There’s really good color balance between the – I can’t believe I’m saying these words – there’s really good color balance between the body fur and the background!

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: Yeah, I mean, that was really well done.

Amanda: Is this like a compliment sandwich?

Sarah: Yeah, it’s a shit sandwich.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: It’s what you get here. Okay.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: All right, so first –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – I will show you – I want to know, speaking of this looks like somebody –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – I’m going to send you a runner-up cover, and tell me what you notice first –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – about this cover.

Amanda: Oh boy!

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: Okay. I get – and I don’t know if this is who you’re go- – it’s a mix for me between Kyra Sedgwick and Taylor Swift.

Sarah: That is exactly what I was thinking. Like, Kyra Sedgwick and Taylor Swift had a baby.

Amanda: Hell yeah.

Sarah: Also –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – when you look at this, you know how you have to design a cover so that it looks good as a thumbnail and looks good in a larger –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: This, in, in thumbnail it looks like she has no arms –

Amanda: Yes.

Sarah: – but hands are coming out of her pants

Amanda: Yes. Yes. No, for real.

Sarah: Yeah.

Amanda: The, ‘cause, like, the elbows are so far tucked back.

Sarah: Yeah. And the hair is so big you can’t see her shoulders. It looks like she has no arms, but then there’s hands coming out of her pants.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: And you, and you notice the early 2000s low-rise jeans, right?

Amanda: I hate it.

Together: I hate it.

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: And the chunky belt.

Sarah: Oh yeah, oh yeah. That’s the, that’s the urban fantasy belt! I bet it has metal studs on it.

Amanda: Ugh.

Sarah: You can’t be an urban fantasy heroine on the cover of a novel if you’re wearing regular pants; you have to wear the urban fantasy belt, which was leather with studs on it. If you –

Amanda: Well, what a blowout she’s got going on.

Sarah: I mean! It really looks like she had a great, one of those, one of those things where you wind up your hair at night and then it has these –

Amanda: Yes!

Sarah: – big, beach-y waves? She did a great job with that technique. I think, I think someone saw it on TikTok and told me about it, which is useless to me ‘cause I have short hair. I also want to draw your attention to the fact that this is the Appleton Wolves trilogy, and I’m pretty sure that Elyse lives in Appleton –

Amanda: Yes, can we ask Elyse –

Sarah: – I feel like I should send this to her and be like, hey –

Amanda: – how many wolves are in Appleton?

Sarah: Guess what; there’s wolves. She’ll be like, great, Pudding will destroy them for me.

Amanda: Oh, for sure.

Sarah: So yeah, that was like, oh, Taylor Swift! Wait, where are her arms?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – was the first thing I thought of with that one.

Amanda: Yes. And of course, howling wolf. Always the classic.

Sarah: Howling wolf. Do you think that there is, like, a wolf photography union where the wolves are like, all right, they’re going to take more pictures for shifter books. All right, you, okay, Sam, you’re going to go on a rock and you’re going to look at the sky. Bob, I need you to look over your shoulder menacingly. All right –

Amanda: Mm.

Sarah: – Teresa, I need you to just look, like, at the camera and look really mad, because chances are you’re going to be put in front of some guy’s crotch. So just look mad about it. Yeah. Wolf poses: the union. Okay –

Amanda: I picture more of it like a stage moms thing where, like –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: – one lady owns a bunch of wolves.

Sarah: Like Dance Moms: the Wolves?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Oh my God! [Laughs]

Amanda: No.

Sarah: All right, this other cover is another runner-up, and I don’t know why this made me laugh, but there are – [laughs] – it’s just cracking me up. Describe this amazing cover, please.

Amanda: So it’s, it’s a bit of a clip art cover.

Sarah:  This is, this is not only clip art; this is like an MS Paint cover.

Amanda: Yeah. So you have a, a blonde, curly-haired fortune teller with her hands posed over an orange crystal ball that has, like, jack-o’-lanterns and bats and trees, and then behind her –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: – is a, I’m assuming –

Sarah: I don’t know what that is!

Amanda: – a silhouette of a werewolf man –

Sarah: I mean –

Amanda: – just cursing the moon!

Sarah: – he’s real mad; real, real mad.

Amanda: And the title is My Hairy Halloween.

Sarah: [Laughs] Okay.

Amanda: Which is unfortunate.

Sarah: The thing that cracked me up is that I saw this cover by accident right before I left to go get waxed, and I was like, ooh, I’m not having a hairy Halloween! There’s also a sequel?

Amanda: I’m, I got waxed later!

Sarah: There’s also a sequel called You’ve Got Tail?

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: Yep. [Laughs] So –

Amanda: Everyone, like, I – can we just have a meeting of just, you don’t have to do a pun! Puns are not necessary, guys. No – is someone making you do pun titles?

Sarah: Yes! All right, so I have the complete reading order of this series. Would you like to know?

Amanda: Oh gosh. Oh, sure. [Laughs]

Sarah: You’ve Got Tail.

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: My Furry Valentine.

Amanda: Oh God.

Sarah: Thank You For Not Shifting.

Amanda: What?!

Sarah: Thank You For Not Shifting, My Hairy Halloween, In the Midnight Howl, My Peculiar Road Trip, Furred Lines, My –

Amanda: No.

Sarah: [Laughs] – My Wolfy Wedding –

Amanda: No.

Sarah: – and Who Let the Wolves Out?

Amanda: It is the year of our Lord 2022 –

Sarah: [Laughs] Oops!

Amanda: – please, I’m begging you, no more “Who Let the Dogs Out?” references. I thought we left that behind us!

Sarah: No.

Amanda: We will never know who let those dogs out; it is an unsolved mystery. Let’s just pack it in, folks.

Sarah: There’s also the Hex Drive series: Hex Me, Baby, One More Time; Oops, I Hexed It Again; and I Want Your Hex. I thought that the pun titles were mostly in the food/bookstore/cat/tea shop mystery.

Amanda: It’s leaking! It’s getting everywhere!

Sarah: Yeah, like Much Ado About Muffin –

Amanda: Stop it!

Sarah: – Grilling the Subject: a Cookbook Nook mystery. The, the pun titles in the mystery world are absolutely astonishing, and they are coming into romance more and more, and I’m honestly not sure how to feel about this, because on one hand –

Amanda: I hate it!

Sarah: – I love a terrible pun; on the other hand, it’s like, eh. I mean, to be fair, they’ve been part of historical romance for a really long time, ‘cause I remember being at an RT awards – so this is some years ago –

Amanda: Mmm.

Sarah: – at a Romantic Times awards ceremony, like, somebody was making, somebody was publishing books, and the titles were all puns of children’s titles like If You Give a Moose a Muffin?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: If You Give a Duke a, I don’t know, Give a Duke a Muffin? I don’t know; do dukes like muffins?

Amanda: [Laughs] Just give everybody muffins.

Sarah: Ah, muffin, muffins are fine. Yeah. So that was my second runner-up, but this is the cover that I have brought you –

Amanda: Oh God.

Sarah: – and I’m very excited about it, and I need to pull up the description because –

Amanda: Okay, okay.

Sarah: – it is amazing. Please –

Amanda: Great.

Sarah: – describe this – [laughs]. All right, we’ve lost Amanda.

Amanda: I audibly, like, gasped! [Laughs] Didn’t know if you caught that!

Sarah: All right, so bef- – tell me what you see, and then I’m going to read you –

Amanda: Yeah, yeah.

Sarah: – the cover copy, because the cover copy –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – fits alarmingly well to this –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – to this –

Amanda: So the, the top half of the cover are two ladies –

Sarah: Yes.

Amanda: – and one of them is, has short, blonde, like, pixie cut.

Sarah: Super cute.

Amanda: Looks very happy to be there, wearing a black tank top. I’m not sure it’s appropriate for fall, but, you know, whatever.

Sarah: I mean, maybe it’s one of those places where, where fall is hot, but, you know.

Amanda: Or, you know, maybe she has a jacket; she can layer.

Sarah: She could be going through perimenopause, having some hot flashes.

Amanda: Right!

Sarah: Little personal summer.

Amanda: And then next to her –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: – is a brunette who looks fucking pissed!

Sarah: This is Side Eye: The Cover, right?

Amanda: So much side eye; side-eyeing the blonde woman, looking so mad that she is there.

Sarah: Yep!

Amanda: The brunette has very heavy dark eyeliner –

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Amanda: – is wearing a leather jacket.

Sarah: Oh yeah.

Amanda: And then the bottom half is just, like, two smiling pumpkins –

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: – a bunch of lights –

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: – and the title is A Hellhound for Halloween.

Sarah: Yep!

Amanda: I’m guessing the brunette is the hellhound –

Sarah: How could you guess!

Amanda: – because she looks pissed!

Sarah: All right, so –

Amanda: She looks so mad!

Sarah: – I’m, I’m going to tell you the cover copy.

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: And I’m going to tell you that this is book two in the Park Rangers Shifters series.

Amanda: Course it is.

Sarah: Course it is.

Amanda: Yeah, of course, yeah.

Sarah: And I am going to try to make it through the first sentence without laughing.

Amanda: Oh boy.

Sarah: Are you ready?

Amanda: I’m ready.

Sarah: Okay. Okay, wait, I’m already losing it. [Snickers, sniffles] Okay.

Amanda: Did not make it very far, Sarah.

Sarah: I did not make it very far; I’m failing already. Okay.

“Chipmunk shifter Charlotte –“

[Laughs] Sorry! All right. You made a face!

Amanda: That’s definitely the blonde. That’s definitely the blonde!

Sarah: You made a face and I lost it.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: I’m going to try one more time here!

“Chip- –“ [laughs]

Amanda: Nope. Maybe third time’s the charm.

Sarah: “Chipmunk shifter Charlotte –“

Amanda: There you go.

Sarah: “– can’t believe it when she finally meets her true mate.”

[Laughs] Chipmunk shifter!

Amanda: Okay, question. Let’s stop – question.

Sarah: Just, just one question?

Amanda: Just one question: when she shifts –

Sarah: I’m crying.

Amanda: – is she the actual size of a chipmunk, or is she a human-sized chipmunk?

Sarah: Ooh, I don’t know! I don’t know!

Amanda: Also, that’s very important for sexytimes.

Sarah: Oh, absolutely!

Amanda: Is it going to, like –

Sarah: Is, have you seen A League of Their Own? The TV series?

Amanda: No, I haven’t watched the TV series.

Sarah: Okay, it’s very, very good, but there is one scene where the main character, Carson, starts a relationship with another woman who’s a lot taller, and the other characters are like, how does the height difference work? She’s so tall! How, what do you do? It’s very funny.

Amanda: You lie down, I guess.

Sarah: So yeah, maybe they can work this out? But anyway –

Amanda: Okay.

Sarah: – Chipmunk shifter Charlotte –

Amanda: Sure.

Sarah: – can’t believe it, finally meets her mate. “She definitely can’t believe it when the gorgeous woman leaves her standing by the side of the road. But Charlotte refuses to give up on her mate and their chance at happiness. When Teresa has to track down a criminal in the state park Charlotte works at, Charlotte grabs the chance to spend more time with her. She’ll show Teresa they’re meant to be together – no matter the risk.

“Teresa lives for the chase. As a hellhound shifter, she never loses a trail and uses her unique skills to find dangerous shifters and bring them to justice.” So she’s a cop. “Meeting her mate –“

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: “– is the last thing she needs. She can’t put Charlotte in danger. She’ll just have to fight her attraction until she’s solved her case and can leave.” ‘Cause that always works.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: “Never mind that her hellhound has decided that only one thing matters – chasing down their mate.

“A Hellhound for Halloween is a steamy shifter romance and perfect –“

Amanda: Hellhound for Christmas!

Sarah: Yeah. “A Hellhound for Halloween is a steamy shifter romance and perfect if you like chipmunks coming to the rescue and stubborn hellhounds!”

Amanda: I thought it was just going to be if you like chipmunks coming, and I was like, excuse me!

Sarah: [Laughs] I regularly think, when I am thinking, wow, I could really go for a shifter romance, I want lesbian chipmunk/hellhound coming to the rescue romance.

Amanda: What do you think is the weirdest shifter pairing we could think of?

Sarah: What is the weirdest shifter pairing we could think of? Okay, I will say, going, going just on this cover, chipmunk shifter and hellhound shifter is a pairing. That’s –

Amanda: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – definitely – I would like to point out, though, the minute you hear Chipmunk shifter Charlotte, you know exactly which one it is! [Laughs]

Amanda: Oh, for sure! For sure!

Sarah: This is outstanding photography selection right here!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Like, do you go to the, do you go to the stock photography site and just start typing in “woman who looks like a chipmunk”? [Laughs]

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: I mean, it totally works! This cover is amazing!

Amanda: I would’ve appreciated more if it, if, if it were switched.

Sarah: Wait, so if the short-haired woman is the hellhound –

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: – and the side-eye angry chick is the –

Amanda: Just like a grumpy chipmunk!

Sarah: [Laughs] I mean, chipmunks should be grumpy. There’s some chipmunks who live, live under my porch, and they are teasing Buzz, and I don’t think they understand how, how much of a long game Buzz will play. He’s like –

Amanda: Oh, for sure.

Sarah: – I’m going to get a Chipmunk, and then he’s going to give it to me, and I’m going to have to pretend to be excited about it.

Amanda: He’s like, look what I brought you!

Sarah: I brought you a dead thing, The Lady. I love you so much!

Aw, thank you so much for putting it on my foot! Oh my God, I’m screaming inside.

It is really hard to put on glasses and headphones at the same time. All right. ‘Cause I was crying, I had salt on my glasses, ‘cause I was crying so hard at chipmunk shifters.

Amanda: Oh no!

Sarah: All right, weirdest shifter.

Amanda: I feel like –

Sarah: Pairing.

Amanda: – the weirdest pairing, you’d, like, lean into the size difference, so it’s like blue whale/water bear.

Sarah: Water bear?

Amanda: Oh – [laughs].

Sarah: What the fuck is a water bear?

Amanda: Google water bear.

Sarah: Do I want to do this?

Amanda: Yeah! It’s not gross.

Sarah: Water bear.

Amanda: They’re tardigrades, right?

Sarah: Oh, it’s a tardigrade! A water bear or a moss piglet are a phylum of eight-legged, segmented micro-animals. So it looks like a potato bug with a little anus for a face.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: So water bear –

Amanda: Or, like, blue whale/head louse.

Sarah: Wow.

Amanda: Just, like, super big/teeny tiny.

Sarah: Super small. Wow. That is a really tough pairing, because it’s one thing to have, like – so, for example, I remember reading a Vivian Arend book where the hero is a wolf shifter and is like, I’ve found my mate, I’ve found her, she is the one, and the person that he’s fallen for is a cat shifter, and she basically looks at him and says, yeah, we don’t do that? So no, I’m not your mate, ‘cause I don’t know who you are! I don’t –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – care what your wolf-y parts say; we’re cats –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – we don’t do that, so how ‘bout we get to know each other and in an ordinary way? He’s like, no! Wolf! Mate! Mine! And she’s like, yeah, no. So I loved that!

Amanda: What if it’s a head louse and they realize that they’ve found their mate once they’ve gotten onto their head?

Sarah: But do they shift into a full-size human?

Amanda: Oh, that’d be funny.

Sarah: Right, because theoretically the, the equilibrium of these two characters is their human form? I mean –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – assuming that, that by shifting we have humans and an animal.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: So shifting between –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – human and some other state. So the, the size differential, if they shift into a human –

Amanda: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: – then that means that there is some sort of size equilibrium between the two of them before they return to their other forms.

Amanda: And they just, like, whisper in the person’s ear, hey, I’m a head lice shifter; we’re mates; and then he, like, hops off the person and –

Sarah: Jumps off someone’s ear and shifts into a –

Amanda: – and then bing!

Sarah: – full naked person?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: All right –

Amanda: See, I’m here!

Sarah: – I’m trying so badly not to scratch my head right now, ‘cause just, the mention of it just makes me itchy. Gih!

But I, I agree the size differential creates a lot of tension.

Amanda: What about an earthworm?

Sarah: An earthworm shifter?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Huh. Who would you pair an earthworm?

Amanda: I just –

Sarah: Like a robin shifter? Don’t make me dinner?

Amanda: Ooh, what an opp-, what an opposites attract! [Laughs]

Sarah: Yeah, right? He should be my dinner.

Amanda: I just want nasty bug shifters; why don’t we get those?

Sarah: All right, now I’m going to look at Amazon bug shifters.

Amanda: You’re probably going to get something real gross.

Sarah: Is that like rule thirty-six of the internet? Like rule thirty-four for me, rule thirty-four is –

Amanda: You’re going to get, I guarantee you’re going to get like a cover of, like, a hot, bikini-clad lady next to, like, a praying mantis bug.

Sarah: [Laughs] That would be awesome!

Amanda: Is what you’re going to get.

Sarah: Dancing with my Elf?

Amanda: [Laughs] Is the elf the bug?

Sarah: Cael, the Were Zoo. I don’t want the weres to be in a zoo, although that apparently has an ant- – ooh! Hang on! I’m going to share this cover with you, ‘cause this is –

Amanda: I can’t – God.

Sarah: This is not bugs. Check out the photo composition on this one.

Amanda: Okay, I’m waiting. Oh, God!

Sarah: They’ve reflected the abs of the hero in the trunk of the elephant.

Amanda: I don’t like it. They kind of like blur together.

Sarah: Yeah, like vroop!

All right so were bugs does not –

Amanda: I’m not, I’m, I typed in bug shifter. [Laughs]

Sarah: I did too, and all I’m finding are motorcycle club shifters.

Amanda: Are they secretly bugs?

Sarah: I mean, maybe!

Amanda: A bug, bug/alien romance novel.

[Laughter]

Sarah: Bug alien. Bug alien romance. Oh. My. God. Well, you can, if you search bug shifters, you can then drill down to secret baby, workplace, alpha male, biker, criminals and outlaws.

Amanda: I found one that’s The Scorpion’s Mate, but the thing that they have on the cover is not a scorpion.

Sarah: Well, that seems like false advertising!

Amanda: This thing has wings. Scorpions don’t have wings, right?

Sarah: I don’t think so! Oh, that’s terrifying.

Amanda: I don’t know about that.

Sarah: There’s also Taken by the Scorpion, The Kraken’s Mate, The Clone’s Mate.

Amanda: Yeah, I see one with, like, a spider, spider guy.

Sarah: Wow. Scorpions, uniqueness of nature –

Amanda: I, I feel like this is an untapped market, so feel free to get in on it.

Sarah: Scorpion mate? Okay, I am pretty sure we’ve snarked this. I’m putting it in the Slack because I need to know if we’ve snarked this. Have we snarked this? I’m pretty sure I remember that tail!

Amanda: Yes. Yeah. Yep, we have!

Sarah: Yep. So Red Planet Dragons of Tajss, Tajzz?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Tajss. I feel bad for the audiobook narrator. Yeah, so that person has a scorpion tail. Wait a minute, is – I don’t understand the, the back and the muscles, but the shape of the body and the hair are all –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – very –

Amanda: Well, he – well, we talked about the hair; I remember that.

Sarah: Right? Can you imagine, though, if you were a scorpion shifter and, and your scorpion tail was just hanging out there, would you be able to, like, brush your own hair without, like, stinging yourself? ‘Cause your tail’s just back there.

Amanda: I would hope so. I would hope you’d have enough control to be able to do that.

Sarah: I don’t know if the most incongruous shifter combination is based on size differential –

Amanda: Hmm.

Sarah: – or habitat differential, ‘cause, like, you can’t, you, you would have some trouble with, if you were a water animal shifter and then –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – a land animal shifter. Like you’d both have to be human and breathing. Unless it’s like that movie Splash where when Tom Hanks dives under the water with Daryl Hannah, he can breathe underwater as long as he’s with her.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: So maybe that would work? You know, you have, like, the Splash rule of breathing underwater? I just want everyone to know, by the way, that I am not high. I am absolutely considering this with an entirely sober brain. This is just how it works. [Laughs] Also, can you believe – just, just pause for a minute – can you believe that this is your job?

[Laughter]

Sarah: Like, it’s literally my job to get Cover Snark in my inbox, and I love it every day. It is so great!

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: So is the, is the biggest shifter – like, ‘cause you, you want to build in a source of tension with your shifter romance, right?

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: You need to have a source of tension, so is it the size differential? Is it the habitat? Or is it the predator/prey conflict?

Amanda: Hmm!

Sarah: Like if you are a worm and a robin?

Amanda: It really, like, taps into that meme of, like, would you still love me if I were a worm?

[Laughter]

Sarah: I mean, I guess?

Amanda: I want someone to write that book and put that line in there.

Sarah: Ohhh!

Amanda: Like someone falls in love with a person not knowing that they’re a worm shifter.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: It’s like, would you still love me if I were a worm? Yes, I would. Well, like, well, then prove it! And then – [slurps] – they shift into their little worm body.

Sarah: Is the best shifter combination something that’s going to create conflict in the plot, or is it, is it something else that’s going to create the, the differential that makes it interesting? Like, for example, I know that a lot of readers email Nalini Singh and are like, how come you haven’t done any stories about the rat shifters?

Amanda: I know.

Sarah: They’re so cool!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: And, and she’s like, that was never in the plans!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: Because rat shifter.

Amanda: I mean, authors have to realize that they’re going to put a character in a book that’s going to be in there for three fucking pages, and everyone is going to be like, when are they going to get their book? And the author’s like, this person was only supposed to be in this series for three pages.

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: And everyone’s like, well, we love them now. You need to make a book.

Sarah: And honestly, anyone who is my age who saw The Secret of NIMH animated movie and saw the hot science rats in their, in their clothes and their secret rosebush, I mean, fuckable rats is totally a thing.

Amanda: I mean, I’m trying to think – not necessarily rats, but, like, The Great Mouse Detective?

Sarah: Totally! But that was just two mice, though!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: That was two mice falling in love. Like –

Amanda: That’s true, mice. But the rat was, like, the bad guy.

Sarah: In The Great Mouse Detective, yes. And in, and in –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – The Secret of NIMH there are good rats and bad rats.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: You know what I should do, I should, like, what time is it in, in, what time is it in, in New Zealand?

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: Nalini!

Amanda: Nalini, get on up! We’ve got to talk about rats!

Sarah: Nalini, we need to know about rat fucking! We need some, we need some rat shifter romance. I mean, I know that there is a contingent of her audience that is like, and the rat shifter, pleeease? What time is it in New Zealand?

Amanda: I feel like night time?

Sarah: It’s four in the morning, so yeah –

Amanda: Ohhh nooo, Nalini!

Sarah: – we’ll leave Nalini alone. There is, I’d be like, Nalini! Wake up! We’ve got to talk about rat fucking.

Amanda: Nalini, you are lucky.

Sarah: I’m sorry, what – and she’s so nice, she would be like, wait, wait, wait! Just let me get some tea –

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: – and we’ll talk about rat shipping. [Laughs]

So I, I think part of it is that, you know, if romance is always like a half step up fantasy, you’re fantasizing about someone with more power, more autonomy, or more money, or more freedom, or more something than you have in your, in your life, in, in, as the reader, you need to, guess, I guess pick a shifter that’s going to engender some sort of admiration. Or you’re aiming for the, I’m slightly grossed out, but this is hot market.

Amanda: I think, like, I’m more bored? Like they’re either werewolves or they’re wolves or, like, bears or like –

Sarah: Lions.

Amanda: Let’s get something interesting! Like, I’m, that’s why I’ve got Shelly Laurenston’s, like, Honey Badgers? That was kind of neat?

Sarah: I loved that.

Amanda: They’re all so, like, they were hybrids, too.

Sarah: Yeah. There were hybrids, and then there were also, like, panda shifters? The panda shifter –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – was one of my favorite characters because he’s just like, I’m really not worried about anything. I’m just going to sit in a tree and eat bamboo. It’s all good.

Amanda: Yeah. So I think, like, mine is just coming from a place of, like, I want just something else. There are so many animals out there; like, why do they always have to be wolves, bears, or lions? Come on.

Sarah: Yeah. I got, I think I got a Rec League request that I CC’d you on of, are there shifters that aren’t wolves? Oh, absolutely there are!

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: What do you want? There is a –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – shifter buffet. But now I’m curious: what is the weirdest shifter you’ve read? And I’m curious about people who are listening: what’s the weirdest shifter they’ve read, right?

Amanda: I feel like I, I don’t really remember any, like, weird ones. I do remember Elyse reading one of the new Psy-Changelings and mentioning that there’s like a whole host of, like, underwater shifters?

Sarah: Yes. In the new Trinity series –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – I haven’t read the latest one yet, ‘cause you know I did that big ol’ epic reread, started at the –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – started at the beginning and just went right through – there’s water animals in the new Trinity. Which makes sense –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – I mean, half, more than half the world is water; there’s animals in there; it makes sense.

Amanda: I feel like the Shelly Laurenston one was probably the most, like the strangest one in recent memory or, like, you know, deviates from the norm.

Sarah: Right. And the thing with Shelly Laurenston’s books is that they are already so over the top and just bombastic?

Amanda: Yeah, you can have a honey badger/Siberian tiger hybrid and be good.

Sarah: Yeah, and I’d be like, okay! Yeah, absolutely. And, and sometimes when I’m reading a Laurenston book I’m like, all right, what animal are you going to be?

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: ‘Cause I know it’s going to be something wild.

Amanda: Yeah, yeah.

Sarah: What are you going to be? Tell me about it. Yeah, I think the Honey Badger were Siberian tiger –

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: – combo was probably the weirdest one I’ve read recently.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: And I, I do hold out hope that Nalini’s going to write the rat shifters, ‘cause I think that’s, that’s a good idea. Should definitely write some rat shifters –

Amanda: For sure.

Sarah: – for sure! Absolutely.

So what are you reading that you want to tell people about?

Amanda: I’m currently reading The Boxing Baroness by Minerva Spencer.

Sarah: Oooh!

Amanda: I just started it, so we’re pretty new, pretty new on it, ‘cause it’s allergy season, so I can’t do anything really.

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Amanda: And just still PowerWash-ing.

Sarah: Oh, I have been PowerWash-ing up a storm while listening to podcasts.

Amanda: Emma and I did the Skate Park the other day.

Sarah: Oh, I’m just about to start that one! I needed – so we hooked, hooked the Xbox up to the TV in the living room, and so I lay down on the couch, I set up a TV tray with snacks and water, I put in podcasts –

Amanda: Oh yeah.

Sarah: – I set up a playlist, and I just listen and watch. Like, I, I subscribe to the Patreon for Maintenance Phase to get the bonus episodes –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – and I’ve just been listening to all the bonus episodes, delighted with all of them.

Amanda: There was one day, I was, like, having a rough week or whatever, and I’m like, Emma, I know you’re busy; do you mind if I PowerWash without you?

Sarah: Awww!

Amanda: And she’s like, go for it. So I took an edible?

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda: And I just sat there and cleaned a driveway.

Sarah: Ohhh!

Amanda: Just like in nice, neat little lines, and just fucking zoned out.

Sarah: Oh, isn’t a driveway so satisfying –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – to, to clean?

Amanda: Yeah. So that’s what I did. Well, we have a, normally we get together on, like, Sunday nights and we PowerWash, or if we’re having, like, a pretty rough week or day we’ll text each other, be like, are you around to PowerWash?

Sarah: [Laughs]

Amanda; And so we’ll get together. I think we got together Sunday afternoon? And it’s like pre-therapy therapy. We just kind of, like, vent –

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: – while we’re cleaning stuff!

Sarah: Yep.

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: I frigging love it. I love how relaxing it is, and I, and I don’t mind being interrupted. It’s not like I’m playing Dragon Age where I’m like –

Amanda: No.

Sarah: – no, no, no, you can’t talk to me. I’m in a cut scene –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – and I’ve got to kill a giant, or this dragon is about to destroy me.

Amanda: Or, like, I will die if I leave my character here. Like –

Sarah: Right. So I have to figure out, like, after I PowerWash and after I finish my quilt that I’m making, what is my next project? And I’m currently, so I just finished reading –

Amanda: Yeah.

Sarah: – rereading Hither, Page. I wanted to read –

Amanda: Yes.

Sarah: – cozy, low-key romance, so I reread that, and now I have to figure out what to read next.

Amanda: In terms of projects, still, still working on the cross-stitch. We got some more plants to go in.

Sarah: Oh, it looks so good!

Amanda: And then my new project that I can’t start yet ‘cause I don’t have everything, everyone, I feel like this Christmas, is going to get personalized D&D dice.

Sarah: Mmm!

Amanda: So I used to do resin stuff, and I would –

Sarah: Yeah!

Amanda: – do it with dried flowers –

Sarah: Yeah!

Amanda: – and making resin dice for D&D isn’t that much different; you just need a mold.

Sarah: Right.

Amanda: So I’m getting a personal set of, like, dice masters made?

Sarah: Oh, that’s amazing!

Amanda: Yeah! So once those arrived, those have shipped, I, like, worked with a person for, like, a little logo and stuff, which is going to be like a little Luna moth on one of the die’s faces?

Sarah: So you’re going to make custom dice for people?

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: That’s so sweet!

Amanda: Once it arrives I can cast it into a mold and then start making dice. But I have, like, resin stuff; I have, like, inks to dye it; I’ve got glitters or, like, mica powder, so, like –

Sarah: Aw!

Amanda: – that’s what I’m going to do.

Sarah: Isn’t it fun when you start something and then maybe a year later you’re like, oh! All of the stuff for this I can use for that!

Amanda: Oh yeah, yeah.

Sarah: Every step on the journey is important.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Sarah: Even the ones –

Amanda: So I’m super pumped about that project.

Sarah: That’s awesome! I want to see pictures.

Amanda: Yeah! Yeah, I think, like, for Christmas I asked for, like, a pressure pot –

Sarah: Oh!

Amanda: – to try to get all of these, like – like with resin, like, bubbles will show up in the resin?

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah.

Amanda: And when I was working with, like, open molds, like coasters, I can easily, like, pop those bubbles with, like, a heat torch?

Sarah: Yeah, of course! You could, there, it’s not that, it’s not that deep; it’s pretty shallow. Yeah.

Amanda: Yeah, but, like, with a resin mold, it’s like – or a dice mold – it’s like thicker –

Sarah: Deeper.

Amanda: – and deeper, so I can’t, like, reach certain spots? So we’ll see; we’ll see how the first batch comes out, not having a pressure pot –

Sarah: That’s so great. And then –

Amanda: – but I’m excited.

Sarah: – you could put, like, tiny little book charms, like the, the kind of charms that you get for jewelry that look like books –

Amanda: Yeah!

Sarah: – or glasses? You could, like, drop them into the resin?

Amanda: Oh yeah. There’s so many, like, inserts and stuff that you can do? A whole lot of –

Sarah: Maybe for, maybe for the site anniversary we can give away a set of dice.

Amanda: Oh, that’d be nice!

Sarah: I would love that.

Amanda: I’m excited for it.

Sarah: It’s so cute! Go you!

[music]

Sarah: And that brings us to the end of this week’s episode. Happy Halloween weekend if you are listening before Halloween, and if you’re listening way into the future, hello! I hope things are wonderful with you.

I am curious: what is the weirdest shifter pairing you have seen? What’s the most memorable shifter you’ve read? I love how in romance nothing is out of bounds when it comes to shifters. I really hope there are blue whale shifters very soon. But I want to hear from you. Please tell me: weirdest shifter pairing, shifter pairing you adore, most memorable shifter you’ve read? You can email me at sbjpodcast@gmail.com; you can leave a message at 1-201-371-3272; you can send me bad jokes. You can join the Patreon and tell us in the Discord! We have a whole channel for talking about each episode. And you can leave a comment on the website. There’s so many ways to tell me your opinion, and you know I want to hear your opinion, so please tell me. Shifters, weirdness, tell me all about it.

I always end with a terrible joke, and this week is no exception. This joke comes from my younger child. Are you ready? He came running into my office to tell me this joke.

Why isn’t a koala a sloth?

Why isn’t a koala a sloth?

Because it doesn’t have the right koala-fications.

[Laughs] I particularly love this joke because – [laughs more] – the college that I went to, I went to a women’s college in South Carolina, and the mascot is a koala, which I always found hilarious because koalas don’t do very much! They sleep like ninety percent of the day, and an enormous number of them have chlamydia? So yeah! Our, our school mascot was a narcoleptic marsupial with the clap. Yay, go us! Koala-fications!

On behalf of everyone here, we wish you the very best of reading. Have an awesome weekend, and we will see you back here next week.

Smart Podcast, Trashy Books is part of the Frolic Podcast Network. You can find more outstanding podcasts to subscribe to at frolic.media/podcasts.

[end of fun music]