358. Vajazzling Vageodes and Writing Romance with Abby Jimenez

[music]

Sarah Wendell: Hello, there. Happy Friday, and welcome to episode number 358 of Smart Podcast, Trashy Books. I’m Sarah Wendell from Smart Bitches, Trashy Books, and today Amanda and I are chatting with Abby Jimenez, who is author of the debut novel The Friend Zone. Now, we had some technical difficulties, so Amanda starts the interview, but then I finish with questions, and then along the way we talk about pretty much everything. Including:

• What it’s like to be a Food Network champion,
• What it’s like to go truly viral with a cake that looks like a crystallized vagina,
• And how Abby wrote this book mostly with her thumbs.

We also discuss The Friend Zone and the inspiration behind the story, and special highlights will include Tom Hiddleston and vajazzling your own Vageode.

Now, I do have a content and potential trigger alert: during the course of the interview we discuss menstruation and body parts, and the conversation frames the book from a cis-centric perspective, given that the characters of the book are cisgendered, but we want to recognize and acknowledge that not all women have vaginas, have uteruses, or menstruate. We also discuss infertility, fibroids, hysterectomy, and the painful pressure and hyperattentive focus on fertility that many people feel. I went through infertility myself for other reasons than the subjects from this book, and some of the discussion in the conversation was really kind of painfully familiar, so I wanted to give you a warning that if this might hurt or feel bad, you might want to skip this episode, because I want you to take care of yourself.

And by the way, you are awesome and wonderful exactly the way you are.

This episode is being brought to you by Project Duchess by Sabrina Jeffries. From one of the biggest and most popular names in historical romance, New York Times bestselling author Sabrina Jeffries, Project Duchess is the first in a sparkling new Regency-era series filled with wit and adventure. As a favor to his still-grieving mother, the very proper Fletcher “Grey” Pryde, Duke of Greycourt, agrees to squire her latest project during the season to help her debut in style. But the lady in question, the outspoken Beatrice Wolfe, has other ideas than being an accessory in her own life. Locked in a thrilling battle of wills, Grey and Beatrice discover that perhaps they desperately want to trade more than pointed barbs at each other after all. Project Duchess is on sale now wherever books are sold, and for more information you can visit sabrinajeffries.com.

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I will have information at the end of the show about the music you’re listening to, about all of the books and links we discuss, and there are many, and I’ll have a preview of what is coming up on Smart Bitches. Plus, this week I have two terrible jokes. Two. Very two. Very terrible. Both jokes very bad for you to enjoy all weekend, because I’m terrible. I also have, in the show notes at smartbitchestrashybooks.com/podcast, a whole bunch of links to social media that you might want to take a look at, including Abby’s dog, who is pretty incredible.

But for now, let’s get started with this interview. On with Abby Jimenez and vajazzling Vageodes and writing romance.

[music]

Amanda: So I’m super excited about this episode after talking with Abby Jimenez’s publicist Estelle, and she’s like, you have to talk to Abby; she has all these interesting stories. The book will make you cry, and it did, so –

[Laughter]

Amanda: – I’m so excited to have her on, and I’d love for Abby, if you would introduce yourself.

Abby Jimenez: I’m Abby Jimenez, and I am the author of The Friend Zone. It’s my debut novel; it just came out on June 11th. And thank you so much for having me here. It’s super exciting to be able to talk about it with people who’ve actually read it, ‘cause for so long, you know, nobody, nobody reads your book, and then everybody reads your book, and it’s kind of crazy!

Amanda: [Laughs] I am totally obsessed with your background as a baker and, like, a Food Network champion and a, a viral sensation. So I’d love to hear more about your food background, and then of course we’re going to have to talk about the cake.

Abby: Yes, the Vageode cake! [Laughs] Well, I guess I should start by saying that all of those things, like my, the fact that I started a bakery or ba-, a baking business out of my house, and I write, and I had that viral Vageode cake sensation that made its way around the world, all of these are things that I did from my house. I, I love podcasts, I just have to tell you, because I can do them without having to put on a bra or pants.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: I actually ha-, I actually have pants on right now, but they’re these, like, footy pajama pants, so they’re not dignified in any way, and that is, like, totally  my jam. I started my bakery business out of my house back in 2007. I just started baking from home after I had my third baby in three years, and it ended up becoming, like, a thing, and two years after I started out of my house I opened up my first retail bakery. And that’s in California; it’s in Palmdale, California, and it’s called Nadia Cakes. And about six months after I opened that, the Food Network wanted to know if I wanted to be on Cupcake Wars, so I auditioned, I made it onto the show, and I ended up winning, which I have to tell you, to this day, I cannot watch food competitions, like, at all.

Amanda: Because you know, like, how the sausage is made, and – [laughs] – that’s too real for you?

Abby: Nah, it, it’s like, I’ve got, like, a touch of, like, PTSD? It’s real competition! I mean, it is –

Amanda: Oh man.

Abby: – it is real, it is exhausting, it is stressful, and, you know, there’s a lot riding on whether or not you win, you know, and they have you, you’re up at four o’clock in the morning. They want you, like, in full hair and makeup by, like, 4:45 in the morning, and you are filming all day. Like, you’re filming until midnight. It is a marathon, it’s absolutely exhausting, and I ca-, I cannot watch those shows anymore, ‘cause it’s just too much.

[Laughter]

Abby: So yeah, I, I won, and I actually went back for a second competition on, for Cupcake Wars, and this was on season nine, and I didn’t end up winning this one, but I did meet Tom Hiddleston. He was –

Amanda: Oh wow.

Abby: They were filming Thor 2. I have zero regrets. I was like, I lost Cupcake Wars, and I would go back a thousand times, because –

Amanda: It’s a fair trade-off.

Abby: It was! They were filming Thor 2 on the soundstage next door, because they film these, this show on, like, an actual Hollywood studio lot. Like, it’s a, an active working studio lot. And so Jaimie Alexander was standing there chatting with me, and I didn’t even know who she was. I was just talking to her, and she was laughing at the funny quotes on my delivery truck, and then Tom Hiddleston walks by in his full-on Loki garb with the cape and the platform shoes and everything, and I almost died. I – it was not dignified.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: Like, I hope one day I get a do-over, and I get to be, like, way cooler when I run into Tom Hiddleston somewhere, but I was, I was very not-cool.

Amanda: Does, does his beauty still translate well in person? Is he just as beautiful in person as on screen?

Abby: Yes. And –

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: – I have to say, he handled my reaction to his presence with a lot of grace, and I could tell he was a nice guy by the, the amused smile on his face and the wave that he gave me as he sauntered by in his, like, four-inch platform Loki shoes. No, but it was super cool. Like, the entire Cupcake Wars Food Network experience is just really, really cool. It’s like you can’t, you can’t buy into it. You have to be invited, you know, and it was just really fun. I’m glad I’m done with it? Like, I don’t think I’ll ever do another competition unless they want me to come back and be a judge or something. I’ll judge the heck out of something, but it’s just so much pressure, like, actually being in a competition; it’s not easy.

So yeah, I did that, and then, you know, we opened up two more locations. My family and I ended up moving to Minnesota, and, ‘cause we really love the seasons and we wanted to live someplace where we could experience winter, and we just didn’t get that in California. So we moved to Minnesota, opened up two more locations, and then last year my bakery had this cake that we made that sort of kind of looked like a vagina, and –

[Laughter]

Abby: – we, my, my staff sent it to me because I’m the admin for all of the Nadia Cakes social media pages, so they send me things that they need me to post. So they send me this picture of this pink geode cake, and I, I didn’t see the vagina. I wouldn’t have posted it if I had, you know. We’re just, we’re a family-run business, not about that, and I ended up sharing it and, like, within minutes, people were commenting that it looked like, it looked like a certain female lady part, and so me, who by this point was already in submissions with my first book and was very used to writing like this witty, wry, kind of sarcastic banter in my books, I just kind of like cracked my knuckles and dove right in, and I was like, oh, these people want to talk about vaginas? Let’s do this! So my comments as the admin for Nadia Cakes ended up going viral. Like, really viral. Like, they were writing articles about it in German viral, and –

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: – it was, it was kind of like this example of like how to, you know, how to do good community management on social media, because I took it with so much – it, it was very self-deprecating. You know, a lot of businesses would be offended by that or would, you know, be upset that someone thought their beautiful geode cake looked like a vagina, and that’s just not how we handled it? We laughed about it, and we laughed with everyone, and it ended up going, like, crazy, crazy viral, and so I ended up getting a ton of social media followers for me, just because people liked my sense of humor and, like, my kind of, you know, witty, sarcastic take on things. So by the time I announced that I had a book deal, and I was like, you guys, this book is funny. Like, if this was me just, like, on the fly bantering with people about this vagina cake, can you picture if I had a whole year to write a book? And so here we are! So The Friend Zone is out, and it’s, it’s very funny, and that’s kind of like where that all comes from, and, and if you haven’t checked out the Vageode saga, I highly recommend you do. Scary Mommy had a really great article about it that I loved that just kind of sums it all up and, like, shared a lot of the best quotes, so check that out, because it’s a lot of fun.

Amanda: I was surprised when the book was announced because of your food and baking background. Like, that doesn’t really factor into the story at all. I mean, Nadia Cakes, there’s like a little Nadia Cakes Easter egg in the book, but I was surprised that – I don’t know! I feel like the easy way out would have been to, like, write a baker character, but would that just be too much crossing, crossing the streams?

Abby: You know, I actually got, when we were in submissions, I actually got a request that they didn’t want this book. They wanted me to write them a bakery series, like a bakery romance series? And I just wasn’t interested in doing it. Like, I, I love what I do; you know, the bakery is fun; but I didn’t want to be tied into that. You know, I wanted to be able to write about characters that did any kind of job that I felt that they needed to do, and, and you know, like, I’m, I’m multifaceted. Like, I’m not just the bakery. As long as I can do it out of my house, I’m, I’m, I’m all about it, you know.

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: So yeah, it, and I know it does seem kind of weird, and you know what’s strange is when I started my bakery out of my house, even that was really weird for me too, because prior to that I was a retail manager. I never went to culinary school; I never worked in a kitchen; I never worked in a bakery; I just baked from home. I liked baking. So I ended up losing my job back in 2007 and decided that to pay the bills I was going to make cakes out of my house, and I remember even then, like six months into it, going, if you would have told me six months ago that I was going to be like this really talented cake decorator, I would have been like, what?! ‘Cause I wasn’t even artistic! Like, I didn’t, it wasn’t even, like, in my wheelhouse, and it just ended up being something I could do. When I, when I like things, I tend to go at them like a hundred percent. You know, like I dive in and I get really focused on it, and I put all my energy on it, so I, I fine-tune my crafts, I guess, very easily in that way? So yeah, everything I’ve done has just kind of had me actually looking back and going oh, I’m shocked! This is weird, you know?

Amanda: It’s funny that you mentioned working from home because in the book the heroine, Kristen, she works from home building these, like, doggy stairs for beds? And it’s a really lucrative business for her, because I feel like the people who really want to pamper their pets and buy them custom dog steps will have the, the discretionary income to, like, go all out on these matching doggy stairs that, like, match their home décor.

Abby: Yeah, well, and the way that I thought up Doglet Nation was I actually have three small teacup Yorkies, and one of them is named Stuntman Mike. I wrote my favorite dog into the book because Kristen needed a small dog, but, like –

Amanda: Do, do your other dogs know that he’s your favorite dog? [Laughs]

Abby: Yes. They know he is the prince, and, but you know what, there’s, there’s five of us in this family, and they all have their people, so it’s not like they’re, they’re not neglected by any stretch, but yes, they know that Stuntman Mike is the doggo of my heart. But yeah, I remember like a couple years ago thinking, there’s so many things that I want to buy for him. Like, I wish that I could, like, find a place where I could get maybe a snarky dog T-shirt that’s fitted to him, and, and there are websites that do that, but I just remember thinking, be so cool if I did that and, like, started a business from home and I called it Doglet Nation, and I only sold merchandise for small dogs, and it was just all about small dogs. So it made sense to me that Kristen, that’s where I got Kristen’s job was from my, you know, thinking…myself.

Amanda: So now we’re going to, we’re going to get into The Friend Zone, and if you want to kind of give a little description of what it’s about. I’ve read it. Maybe the people who are listening will have read it by then, but if not, feel free to give us a little summary.

Abby: So The Friend Zone is a story about a woman who is struggling with infertility, and kind of a lesser-known fact unless you’ve read all the way through to the author’s note at the end is I actually based this fictional love story around a real-life infertility struggle. So my best friend Lindsay had a full hysterectomy at the age of just twenty-nine, so the infertility struggle from start to finish in The Friend Zone is almost word-for-word what happened to her. I sat down and I interviewed her, and, like, that’s why when you read it, it feels so authentic, because this is an actual infertility struggle. Lindsay suffer-, suffered from severe uterine fibroids, and it is a condition that makes your periods horrendous. It, it’s benign tumors that grow in your uterus, and they can get so big that they push your organs around, they make it difficult for you to go to the bathroom, it makes sex painful, you bleed constantly, and it also leads to infertility, because the embryo has a hard time implanting in a uterus that’s full of tumors. And I actually ended up, I actually wrote the second book in the series, which is The HEA Playlist. That comes out in April 2020. I actually wrote that book first. That was the book that got me my literary agent, and that was the book that we began shopping around to publishers.

Amanda: That makes a lot of sense, given the events that happen in The Friend Zone, which I won’t spoil –

Abby: Yes. So –

Amanda: – but that makes a lot of sense.

Abby: -there, there is an event in The Friend Zone, and you will know it when it happens, but a lot of people were like, that’s messed up, yo! And, like, here’s the thing: that thing always happened. It happened because I wrote the second book first. So The Friend Zone, I loved Kristen so much in book number two that I thought, wouldn’t it be so cool to go back in time and to see her love story and to follow this character who’s, you know, just, she’s just a character! Like, she’s got so much personality. She just is kind of unapologetically is who she is, and then we could live through events that carry into book two, so that’s what I did, and I modeled these two friends in the book, Kristen and Sloan, I modeled them after me and my best friend Lindsay, so when I started writing Kristen, it was just natural to me that the main conflict in her relationship would be the infertility, because that’s what Lindsay struggled with, and Lindsay, my best friend, she ended up marrying a Josh, and he was very understanding to her condition. He wanted her. And so it was, it was very, I don’t know, it was kind of like amazing to be able to write this story and know that there are, there are men like this out there. This isn’t, like, some fictional fantasy story fairytale. You know, there are men out there that, that look beyond the state of your uterus, you know, that view this as not your problem but as our problem, because we are in a relationship, and this is our problem to deal with together, and that’s why when you, you know, when you read Josh you fall so in love with him, and, you know, he’s so patient and so understanding. Well, there are really men like that out there, so.

Amanda: So I’M GOING TO SPOIL THIS PART, ‘cause I want to talk about it, and we’ll, we’ll put timestamps in for people who don’t want to be spoiled. But Josh is so lovely, and at the end where he’s, he’s really fighting for Kristen and she doesn’t want him to give up his dream of a big family, and he’s trying to convince her that, like, they can make it work. They can have the family that, you know, they’re meant to have, and he has to realize that, like, he needs to tackle this problem in a language that Kristen understands, and Kristen understands logic, and so he compiles, you know, test results and packets and pamphlets on all the different routes they can go about having a family if that’s something she wants to do. You know, adoption, IVF, if she wants to go through with her surgery immediately, and kind of lays all the details out there for her to look at. You know, he gets, like, a sperm count test and, because, like, that is what makes sense to her, that’s how she kind of argues and debates is through logic, and I really just loved the moment of him, you know, instead of trying to put a square peg into a round hole and, like, making her understand, he identifies, you know, the communication style that will get through to her to show her what, you know, she means to him. [END SPOILER]

Abby: Yeah. When I was writing that – you know, I have to tell you, I did a ton of research for this book, a ton, and one of the recurring themes that just kept circling back was the feelings of worthlessness, the feelings of sacrifice that women felt when they were discussing what it’s like to be with their partners when they’re going through this type of diagnosis. It’s so common. It is so common for women to feel this way, and the reproductive burden falls so heavily on us as women. It was very hard to do research for this. It was really heartbreaking.

Amanda: There was an article going around on Shondaland about how fibroids can really debilitate you and just affect the little things, like whether or not you feel well enough to go to work, and that was something Kristen struggled with, that she couldn’t keep a normal schedule, which is why she started her own business and was working out of her house, but even, there were times when, you know, Josh would come over, and she’s laid up on the couch with a heating pad, and she feels awful. And I liked that we see a, a heroine going through a lot of things that we experience as, you know, women who menstruate and get really bad cramps and have to deal with all of this, and so I really liked seeing that on the page, because sometimes romance exists in a vacuum, you know, where, like, no one gets their periods, and everything is fine, and you don’t have to deal with, like, the, the less-than-savory parts of, of being a woman. You know what I mean? [Laughs]

Abby: Yeah. You know, so much of being a woman is just, honestly, like, going through your day despite all of the things that you’re dealing with in the background. You know, like, like Kristen says, you know, I, I lived with pain like I, like it was background noise. Like, it was part of her everyday existence. It was just what she had to deal with every single day, and we do that as women all the time. You know, oh, you’ve got a, a busy, you know, hectic day today? Your kids are sick? Too bad; you’re on your period. You know? Or you’ve got cramps, or you’re pregnant. You know, I mean, these are things that we just have to suck up and deal with, and it’s unfortunate, and it’s kind of weird that nobody talks about it in romance, because a romance is about two people, you know, figuring out how to make it work, and, you know, whether you want to have kids or not have kids, that’s always a core discussion with a partner, you know? I mean, whether you’re on the same page or not on the same page, whether or not to have children is a central part of any relationship, so it’s a little strange that infertility isn’t more discussed in romance or periods aren’t more discussed. You know, periods affect your sex life one way or another. Even if you don’t care and he doesn’t care, you know, the reader might care. You know, you have to write these things in, and you’ve got to address them.

Amanda: I’ve gotten several requests previously for book recommendations where the hero and heroine, you know, have period sex, because it happens, and I will say that, like, it happens in this book. Kristen is spotting, and she warns Josh, and Josh is like, I, I don’t care! [Laughs]

Abby: Yeah, he doesn’t!

Amanda: And he didn’t. And I, I also think it’s central to his character that he is the youngest in a family of nine. He has –

Abby: He’s the –

Amanda: Or eight?

Abby: He is the seventh –

Amanda: He has like six older sisters.

Abby: He’s got six older sisters.

Amanda: Yes, and so I think that really helps shape his view on women and what happens to women’s bodies, and, you know, he has no problem running out and picking up tampons or pads or, you know, knowing what period hacks there are to, like, help with pain or fatigue. Josh is a very supportive hero, and I think that’s what I liked about him. He doesn’t, like, balk or, you know, scoff or be grossed out by what Kristen is going through or the fact that she needs tampons to get herself through the day. He’s pretty much all in on everything about Kristen, and I think that’s what I liked most about him as a hero?

Abby: Yeah! He’s just, you know, he’s got all these older sisters, and he’s been totally desensitized, and, you know, men should be desensitized. [Laughs] They all have moms, you know. A lot of them have girlfriends and wives. Like, that always blew my mind when, you know, someone tells me that their boyfriend or their husband won’t go buy them pads. It’s like, why, you know? Like, this is a part of everyday life. It’s a part of our lives, you know, for thirty years of our lives. Why, why can’t men just go pick up tampons? I don’t get it. And when I wrote it in, it’s funny because I actually kind of modeled Josh after the way my brother is. My brother had two sisters, and he’s a single dad to a little girl, and he’s just like, what? Like, go get the tampons. Like, I don’t care, you know?

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: But yeah, I, I really loved the way that Josh was, and I loved that the barriers that, that Kristen had with Tyler, the things that, you know, she mentioned about Tyler were not even a thing to Josh. And, and you know, a lot of guys – not that I was villainizing Tyler, because a lot of men don’t enjoy period sex; a lot of women don’t enjoy period sex; that’s totally fine – but I liked that Josh didn’t care, especially when, to be honest, if he did care, he probably wouldn’t have had a very active sex life with Kristen. You know, so it worked. It worked for her, it worked for him, and, and it was sensitive to her condition on his part.

Amanda: So Tyler in the book is Kristen’s boyfriend going into it, so we, we go into it with Kristen already in a relationship, which is a bit of a deviation, I think, from the, the standard romance fare. I think it’s respectfully done. Tyler isn’t necessarily a villain, and, you know, Josh and Kristen kind of form this very easy friendship, and I was very curious about that direction, to have the heroine be involved with someone else, it not work for very valid reasons. I wouldn’t call it a love triangle because, you know, they’re not very intermeshed, if that makes sense? But there is this nice –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Amanda: – kind of, I suppose, transition between Kristen being involved with someone at the start and then her building this easy friendship with Josh, and I was just very curious about that decision, given that we normally don’t see heroines already involved with someone else.

Abby: I, you know, when I wrote Tyler, originally I was going to write him where it’s obvious they’re not made for each other. You know, that it’s, you know, maybe he’s just beneath her or, you know, not in the same league, and then I thought to myself, you know, that is, like, so done, and really, like, where’s the conflict in that? Because then you’re just kind of waiting for that dude to be out of the picture, ‘cause you know he’s going to, you know? And I thought, what, what if Tyler was actually really great?

Sarah: Mm-hmm?

Abby: You know, he’s smart; he’s intelligent; he’s thoughtful towards her. He’s just not The Guy. You know, he’s not The Guy For Her, and really, Kristen’s reasons for being with Tyler in a lot of ways were out of convenience, because he wasn’t there to go through all of the challenges that we see Josh go through with Kristen in terms of her periods and, and how she doesn’t feel well and, you know, Tyler didn’t want kids. You know, and it’s funny because – [laughs] – you know, Tyler is so honestly like somebody I would date. You know what I mean? Like, I, I love people that, like, love good food, you know? And, and –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: – there was a couple of people who were like, why is she villainizing people that like good restaurants? And I’m like, I am not! I love good restaurants. It’s just that in this particular situation, Kristen was not a match for him. She was better suited with somebody else, and I think that that’s so true –

Sarah: Right.

Abby: – in life. Like, you know, you could have laid Josh and Tyler side by side like two resumes for the same job, and Tyler would have been the obvious candidate, but he just wasn’t, you know? And Kristen is very much principled? She’s a very principled person, and you know, she would not have cheated on Tyler if Tyler hadn’t been the one to – I mean, she didn’t cheat on him, period, but – there’s no cheating in this book –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Abby: – but Tyler was the one that made that decision in –

Sarah: Right.

Abby: – their relationship. What happened with the relationship was really on Tyler.

Sarah: So is Tyler going to be a hero of a future book maybe?

Abby: You know what’s so funny? Okay, this is like, this is crazy to me. So I thought that everybody was going to want a Tyler book, you know? I mean, here’s this poor guy, he doesn’t get the girl, but he was this amazing, amazing character. Just, you know, he was a great guy! Like, we want to see him fall in love with somebody and, and win her hand. You know who everybody wants a book about is Shawn. Like, what is that –

Sarah: Shawn!

Abby: Yes!

Amanda: [Laughs]

Abby: The jerk from Brandon’s fire station! Everybody’s like, I love Shawn! I mean, I, I don’t know. Maybe Shawn, you know, quits the fire station, and he, like, goes to Vegas and starts this business called Thirst Responders where they provide IVs and shots of B12 to people who are recovering from hangovers, and he wears, like, you know, leopard pants with his pompadour and it’s like a thing. Like, maybe that’s Shawn’s book; I don’t know. I could see it. I could kind of see it. But yeah, nobody, nobody’s requesting Tyler; it’s the funniest thing. Like, you’d think that they would, but I have, hardly anybody wants a Tyler book.

Amanda: I want Tyler. I want Tyler. He’s like an interpreter; he speaks all these languages; he’s got really intense foodie vibes? I’m, I’m here for a Tyler book.

Abby: Now, I realize that my jam, you know, as I, I’m heading into my third book – I got a three-book deal with Forever Romance – and you know like when you first start writing, maybe you kind of don’t know, like, what kind of heroes you’re going to write. You know, like, L. J. Shen is, like, you know A-hole alpha males. Like, that’s her thing, you know what I mean?

Sarah: Mm-hmm. Yep.

Abby: And, and for a while there I didn’t really know what my thing was, and I think I know what it is now. It’s going to be these very relatable kind of guys that you would know in real life; like, these are the men that I like to write. But I will say that I am working on a story with a guy who is very much a Tyler. He was educated; he’s not a blue collar worker; he’s, you know, a very prominent businessman; and he does like good food; and he does appreciate fine wines; and he likes all of the things that I like in my husband. So yeah, I, I do have a Tyler-esque gentleman coming up. It’s not going to be probably book three; maybe book four.

Sarah: Well, that’s certainly good news. If, if your skill is writing these really decent human beings who are kind and emotionally fluent, I love that, so write all of them. Keep going. More, more, more, please. And if you want to put them in leopard pants, that also fun.

[Laughter]

Abby: Yeah, I think Shawn would have a lot of redeeming to do. Like, he’d have to have, like, a major come-to-Jesus or something, ‘cause he’s kind of –

Sarah: Yeah! [Laughs]

Abby: Yeah. He’s a bit of a, a, a chauvinistic jerk. [Laughs] But yeah, I, it’s funny that people want him; it’s just, it blows my mind.

Sarah: Has your writing process changed a little bit as you’ve written these books? Like, you have one out and you’re, having experienced the, the utter exhaustion of launching a book, has your writing process changed a little?

Abby: I am very much a pantser. I fly by the seat of my pants. I don’t really plot things out.

Sarah: Yeah, me too. [Laughs]

Abby: Yeah, that’s just like, that’s just how I do it, and I write, actually, quite a bit on my cell phone, on a Google Doc with my thumbs. I probably wrote seventy-five percent of The Friend Zone on my cell phone. I just kind of write wherever I am. I don’t have, like, a process where I sit down, I have to open my computer and, like, you know, have my drink, and I have to be dead quiet. Like, that’s just not how I write. I’m just a very – you know, almost, I kind of write the way you do social media! You know, you do it everywhere and whenever you feel like it and kind of all the time, and that’s, that’s how I write. I will say that there is definitely a difference between being a writer and being an author, meaning, like, the author part is where you have to promote the book, and you have to, you know, be there for readers and, and engage on social media. That’s just a whole different job, and it’s a whole different animal, and it’s exhausting. I was inundated. Like, the two days after my book came out, I was absolutely inundated. I was getting DMs, several, every minute for like two days straight. It was crazy. It was very flattering. I was – I mean, I’d rather have that problem than have the other problem where it’s like, you know, radio silence and nobody cares. But it, it is definitely a job, and it’s a ton of work, and just to kind of manage my own mental wellness during this very exciting and overwhelming time, I’m actually not working on any other projects other than editing The Happy Ever After Playlist, which I have to turn in in a few weeks, but I’m not doing any, like, hardcore sit down, crank out books type writing.

Sarah: Yeah, launching and writing are two very different skill sets, and it’s, it’s –

Abby: Oh –

Sarah: – very challenging to do them both at the same time.

Abby: Yes, it really is. I feel like I’m being pulled in a million different directions, and then on top of that I still, you know, I have three bakeries, and I have three kids, and I have four dogs. [Laughs] Like, there’s a lot going on in my world –

Sarah: Literally, piece of cake!

Abby: Yeah, I feel like a, like a computer with, like, you know, two hundred thousand tabs open, like, at all times.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: But yeah, and you know, the writing is very calming for me? Like, I, I enjoy writing. It is my hobby, it’s what I do for fun, and if it ever stops –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Abby: – being fun, I’m not going to do it anymore. You know, there’s, there’s jobs, and then there’s hobbies, and for me, even though this is a paying hobby, it is still a hobby, so I’m, I’m all about, you know, managing myself, having balance.

Sarah: You also mentioned that your friend Lindsay was the inspiration for your main character. What was it like working with her, and what does she think of the finished book?

Abby: So Lindsay and I have a very interesting friendship, and if you follow me on social media you know exactly what I’m talking about; it is weird. A lot of the things that happen in the book, like Kristen sending Sloan a glitter bomb, these are actual things that Lindsay has done to me.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: I’m very, I’m very much a Sloan. My eyelid twitches when I’m under stress. It’s been twitching for, like, the last six weeks. It’s just, like, who I am as a person now. I don’t even talk about it anymore. And yeah, so you know, really, a lot of people say that the friendship in the book feels authentic and that, you know, obviously the infertility struggle feels authentic. Well, that’s because this truly is based on me and Lindsay and the way we would handle situations and how we would support each other during certain things. She is super, super proud of me, like crazy proud of me. She says if I ever hit, like, the New York Times bestseller list she’s going to get my book tattooed somewhere on her body. So you know, I don’t know if you’ve bought the book already, guys, but if you needed any extra incentive, just know that this, this woman will carry this tattoo to her grave if you buy my book and we hit a list. Yeah, she’s just very proud of me. Very, very proud of me.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: She always is, and I’m proud of her.

Sarah: Having that type of friendship in your life is also, I think really important as you get older.

Abby: Oh yeah.

Sarah: ‘Cause it’s someone you can be your genuine self with.

Abby: Yeah, and I think as you get older, I mean at least in my experience, you have less friends, but the friends that you have are real friends; you know, they’re quality friends. And Sloan and Kristen are everything to each other. You know, they are each other’s islands, and even just the way they protect each other – you know, Kristen didn’t even tell Sloan she was having a hysterectomy until halfway through the book because she wanted –

Sarah: Mm-hmm.

Abby: – to protect Sloan and, and her special time right before her wedding. You know, she didn’t want that to be a, a shadow across Sloan’s wedding. You know, so they’re very self-sacrificing when it comes to each other. They’re very considerate and thoughtful of each other, and it, it does feel like a very authentic friendship because it is. That’s how it is with me and Lindsay.

Sarah: Amanda also wants me to ask about Stuntman Mike and the decision to put him in the book. How similar is he to book Stuntman Mike?

Abby: Well, I knew that I wanted Kristen to have this business. I knew Kristen, because of her condition, I knew that she had to work from home, and –

Sarah: Right.

Abby: – I loved the idea of Doglet Nation, because that was an idea that I’d had a long time ago, and so I thought, well, she needs a dog, and it’s got to be a small dog, and you know what, I have this small dog, and he’s really great, and he’s got a ton of personality, and he’s a total character, so why not write him into the book? And it’s, it was kind of funny how, you know, things that I just kind of decided to add in ended up weaving themselves into kind of the meat and bones of the story, like Kristen and Josh love Tarantino. Well, my dog Stuntman Mike is named after a character in Quentin Tarantino’s movie Death Proof, so I love his name. He’s just so goofy, and the name is hilarious, so when I made Stuntman Mike her dog, it just made sense to have Kristen love Tarantino and have Josh also love Tarantino. So you know, these things kind of –

Sarah: Makes sense!

Abby: – weave themselves through. Yeah, and Stuntman Mike, I wrote him exactly as he is. He has his own Instagram; it’s stuntman.mikey, and if you follow him, you will see that, and he is exactly like I wrote him, and he’s very opinionated. He’s got a lot of feelings, and he’s very picky about who he will let close to his mama.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: So that, that was very true to the story. He definitely has a lot of opinions about people.

Sarah: A good pet in a book is always a good thing. Now, we always ask this question: what are you reading and enjoying right now, if anything, since book launch is an all-encompassing experience, in addition to kids and dogs and a business. Are there any books that you’re recommending or reading that you would like to tell people about?

Abby: So right now I am heavily editing The Happy Ever After Playlist, so I’m not reading anything right now, but what I read right before that was Fix Her Up by Tessa Bailey, and she is freaking hilarious. Like, not just in her writing – I thoroughly enjoyed that book, and it’s phenomenal, and you should totally buy it – but she’s hilarious as a person. Like, I really like her. I feel like me and her could go places and day drink. So if you don’t –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: – like, follow her on social media. She is awesome. And she, and, and you know what? She is, in real life, I can feel her in her book because it’s the same funny, like, witty banter in her books that she is like on social media? So yeah, that’s what I read right before that, and that right before that, I read The Radium Girls, and then I read Daisy Jones & The Six, all fabulous books; cannot recommend enough. I get all of my recommendations from Bookstagrammers who, I have to tell you, that is such a kickass community. Like, Bookstagrammers –

Sarah: Isn’t it?

Abby: – they are awesome! They are so awesome! It’s like this posse of, like, really cool book people, and when I was at Book Con, there was a couple that I had connected with that came and saw me, and it’s just so cool meeting them in person and, like, following their stories and, and, you know, it’s all, they don’t just talk about books, you know? They talk about their life; they show pictures of their pet. You know, I follow all their stories, and I’m just having so much fun being submerged in that universe. It’s, like, it’s awesome.

Sarah: That’s excellent. Is there anything else you want to make sure that you mention or add?

Abby: Definitely follow me on social media, because I share little tidbits now and then about my writing process or, you know, where I’m at in the publishing process, and if, like, if you want to see things like, you know, if you want to know exactly when my books are up for pre-order, that, that’s a great place to be. Follow me on Twitter or social media, and you never know what I’m going to say. You know, maybe, maybe something I say is going to go viral. I’ve actually had quite a few tweets go viral, and I write some of those tweets into my books, ‘cause I know –

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: – I know they work, you know? Know, I know people like ‘em.

Sarah: Yes.

Abby: Heh.

Sarah: Have you received a lot of orders for additional Vageode cakes?

Abby: Oh yes, the Vageode cakes are –

Sarah: I figured as much. [Laughs]

Abby: They are so hot right now. We, we actually ship them nationwide. We ship Vageode cakes nationwide. It’s pricey –

Sarah: That’s beautiful!

Abby: It is beautiful, and you know what? Like, we can’t ship it with all the little rock candies on it because it’ll fall apart and get all messed up during shipping –

Sarah: They all fall off, yeah.

Abby: – so you have to assemble it on site, so when you’re Vageode cake arrives you get to be a Vageode vajazzler, and there’s –

Sarah: You have to vajazzle your own geode cake!

Abby: Yes!

Sarah: Oh my gosh! [Laughs]

Abby: I mean –

Sarah: I love this so much!

Abby: – it’s like a team-building event! Like, get your girlfriends, you know; order one for a birthday or bachelor party. Everybody gather around, and let’s vajazzle this Vageode cake. And I wrote the instructions on how to vajazzle this thing, so they’re, like, really funny. It, it’s almost worth buying the cake and having it shipped just to get the instructions. It’s like, press the rocks into the crack, and if they’re not sticking, your crack isn’t wet enough.

Sarah: [Laughs]

Abby: You know, like, all of the things you would, all of the things you would expect from the admin behind the Vageode cake.

Sarah: I cannot breathe right now! [Laughs] That is brilliant. Thank you so much for doing this interview. I, I love the idea that you have to vajazzle your own Vageode.

Abby: There’s no better way.

[music]

Sarah: And that brings us to the end of this week’s episode. I want to thank Abby Jimenez for hanging out with us. If you would like to find her on the internet there are many places to do so, and of course I will have links to them, but if you are in a place where you can’t easily access the wonderful internet, her website is authorabbyjimenez.com, her Twitter is at Author Abby J-I-M, Jim [@AuthorAbbyJim], and on Instagram, authorabbyjimenez. And of course the crucial one, her dog, is stuntman.mikey on Instagram. He’s very small, he’s very cute, and he’s really kind of awfully adorable; it’s really hard to look away. [Laughs]

If you have thoughts on this interview or suggestions or ideas, please email me: sbjpodcast@gmail.com, or you can leave a message at 1-201-371-3272. You can tell me a bad joke, you can email me a bad joke – I love all of those – or you can give me ideas of what you’d like to hear about on a future episode.

This week’s episode is brought to you by Project Duchess by Sabrina Jeffries. From one of the biggest and most popular names in historical romance, New York Times bestselling author Sabrina Jeffries, Project Duchess is the first in a sparkling new Regency-era series filled with wit and adventure. As a favor to his still-grieving mother, the very proper Fletcher “Grey” Pryde, Duke of Greycourt, agrees to squire her latest project during the season to help her debut in style. But the lady in question, the outspoken Beatrice Wolfe, has other ideas than being an accessory in her own life. Locked in a thrilling battle of wills, Grey and Beatrice discover that perhaps they desperately want to trade more than pointed barbs at each other after all. Project Duchess is on sale now wherever books are sold. For more information, visit sabrinajeffries.com.

The transcript this week is being brought to you by our Patreon community. Thank you, Patreon community! If you would like to join, it would be absolutely most appreciated if you did: patreon.com/SmartBitches. Monthly pledges begin at one dollar a month. Each and every pledge makes a deeply appreciated difference, keeps the show going, and makes sure that every episode has a transcript. We are currently picking our third quarter book club book, so if you liked Rebel Hard and you’d like to join the community, tell us what to read, that would be great. Patreon.com/SmartBitches.

The music you are listening to is provided by Sassy Outwater. She’s on Twitter @SassyOutwater. This is Caravan Palace, and this track is called “Lazy Place.” You can find it on Amazon or on iTunes, and you can find Caravan Palace at caravanpalace.com. Much to my disappointment, it does not appear that they have an Etsy – Etsy? Not Etsy. MySpace. I’m about to talk about Etsy, but the thing I want them to have is a MySpace, and they don’t have a MySpace, because that’s always my favorite, when a band has a MySpace page! [Laughs]

Speaking of Etsy, here’s what’s coming up on Smart Bitches! Let’s go shopping! I am taking everyone on a tour of my Etsy wishlist, and I’m inviting you to share the things that you have wishlisted for yourselves. Basically, I have a problem with literary jewelry and I want to share it, so be ready. We will also have a new Cover Snark, reviews of new titles, a new edition of the Rec League, plus Help a Bitch Out and daily e-book sales. You are invited to come on over and hang out with us, because it’s awesome when you do.

I will have links to all of the things we talked about, including the Vageode cake and where you can order one if you’ve decided that you would like to vajazzle your own Vageode, and I will have links to the books that we mentioned as well.

But as always, I will end with a terrible joke. Are you ready? I have two terrible jokes this week. One – [laughs] – is so dumb.

What did Raichu say to Pikachu wearing a detective hat?

What did Raichu say to Pikachu wearing a detective hat?

Raichu.

‘Cause they always say their own names! [Laughs] I told that to my older son, who is, anything with a taxonomy is his catnip, and he was like, that was really dumb, Mom; I can’t believe I stood up to answer the door. And I’m like, yeah, but I’m so great with these bad jokes.

And I forgot to turn off my phone again! I’m amazing! I’m the worst podcaster ever!

Okay, ready for the next joke? Here we go. This is my favorite. [Laughs, clears throat]

Did you hear about the new origami porn site?

Yeah, origami porn site?

It’s paper view only.

Paper view! [Laughs] Thank you to Kitten on Reddit for that one, because that’s just so dumb! I love it so much.

On behalf of everyone here, we wish you the very best of reading. Have a wonderful weekend, and we will see you back here next week.

[hammock time music]