Cry Wolf and Hunting Ground by Patricia Briggs

Bitchin' Blog Posts

by SB Sarah | by SB Sarah | December 09, 2009 | Wednesday at 12:22 pm | 70 Comments

Title: Cry Wolf
Author: Patricia Briggs
Publication Info: Ace 2008
ISBN: 0441016154
Genre: Paranormal

I’m embarrassed to admit there was gaping hole in my werewolf romance reading, but I’m so glad I fixed it by reading these books.

Anna is an abused werewolf, changed against her will and subjected to hideous abuse and assault by her former pack. Charles is the son of and executioner for the Marrok, the werewolf who is alpha over all the the packs in North America. When Charles was sent to clean up the mess of Anna’s pack, his arrival set off a series of small explosions in their private world. Charles’ wolf chose Anna as his mate. Anna learned she was an Omega wolf, not a submissive worthless wolf as she’d been told. Anna chose to accompany Charles back to Montana, where he was healing from the battle with her former pack Alpha, and where another adversary is attacking people without much finesse in the Cabinet mountains.

Cry Wolf opens with Anna relentlessly trying to be strong when she’s been told for so long that she is worthless and weak and not worth protecting. Suddenly she’s valuable and everything she knew and learned on her own as a werewolf is only partly true. Charles is as mystified by Anna as she is by him - and both welcomes and fears the out-of-control feeling she creates in him, after centuries as a relatively stable werewolf.

Hunting Ground continues Anna and Charles’ story a few months after the events in Cry Wolf. The Marrok maintains his conviction that he should take the werewolves’ existence public as many other fae have, and a summit is held so that other packs from other countries can address their concerns with his plan. When Charles convinces his father that he and Anna should go instead, they enter a delicate political nightmare that requires more balance and deftness than he and Anna can handle.

Now, I don’t as a rule follow series books, and I am loathe to start a series especially when there’s no finite ending. But the manner in which Briggs reveals the conflicts between Charles and Anna and the individual challenges facing them in each book is more than enough to keep me reading. But beyond the individual books themselves are the themes and redefining of archetype that I cannot get enough of. What I love about these books is that they reexamine the concept of Alpha, both wolf and hero. How difficult must it be to be angry and dominate others all the time, all pounding and chest thumpy all day long. The alpha hero doesn’t get a break - and that instinct-level dominance must be exhausting.

Enter the Omega, who provides balance and harmony, a solution and a way in which to examine the power and limitations of the alpha, both the alpha in the mythology, and in the tradition archetype in romance.

The relationship between Charles and Anna is one thing, and it’s an amazing thing. Theirs is an instant-attachment between strangers. His wolf chose hers. Her wolf is down with that. He is unquestionably drawn to her, and loves her. She is horrified that she needs someone she doesn’t know very well, and is terrified of needing someone who can hurt her. Their story is about love and strength and recovery from trauma and hurt - and it’s a powerful thing to grow slowly over time. It echoes that which draws readers to Eve and Roarke: a continued growth of two wounded, isolated people who find they have one other person so very much like them, so alluring they can’t let go. It turns the instalove on its head, and recasts it as a source of conflict. Their wolves are mated. They have chosen one another in a limited fashion. What next, as they must be together now? How to resolve everything else, both internal and external?

Stroke of goddam genius, I tell you.

The relationship between the Alpha and the Omega gives known wolf mythology a quarter-turn so it looks entirely different, and demands reexamination of traditional gender roles as well, as the Omega is, though not always, a female. Charles is a 200+ year old Native American werewolf with more than ordinary powers and a necessary isolation from everyone else. He can’t make friends. He may have to kill them. Anna was isolated deliberately and abused until she was nearly broken, and now isn’t sure what instincts she should trust: those born out of terror and fear or those that come with her werewolf personality - or should she ignore both sets and try to remember what it was to be human?

The balance of harmony is cast into characters with instinctive and pre-determined roles - Alphas and Omegas are born the way they are, even as humans prior to being changed in to werewolves - and the world built around that concept creates a new set of questions about why and how effective romance relationships work, and how enduring couples through a continuing series maintain their attraction for readers.

I’m so glad I was introduced to this series, though I’ve had to stop myself from rereading more than once. Now, on to the allure of Mercy Thompson.

Filed: General Bitching, Reviews, Grade A, Authors, A-C

Tagged: werewolves, patricia briggs, hero, gender, america

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Janine said on 12.09.09 at 01:27 PM • [link]

I love this series too. Did you read the novella where Charles and Anna first meet? It’s called “Alpha and Omega” and can be found in the anthology On the Prowl.
orangehands said on 12.09.09 at 02:05 PM • [link]

I absolutely love werewolf stories (there’s a GS vs STA post I would love), but I wasn’t the biggest fan of Cry Wolf. I did, however, like it better than the first book of the Mercy Thompson series. I was planning on cautiously continuing Anna & Charles’ story, but someone told me Mercy {S-P-O-I-L-E-R} is raped by the hero (or one of the hero options) and since that is a major trigger/hot button issue I’m saving myself future pain of trying to involve myself in a series I won’t be able to continue {E-N-D S-P-O-I-L-E-R}. (Feel free to let me know if this spoiler is untrue; I am unsure if I read it correctly and couldn’t find someone to tell me.)

Anyway, I’m glad you found yourself an A book. Those are very precious when you get one, even if others don’t agree about the status.
Tina C. said on 12.09.09 at 02:44 PM • [link]

someone told me Mercy {S-P-O-I-L-E-R} is raped by the hero (or one of the hero options)

Someone was confused (or didn’t actually read the book). SPOILER ALERT to anyone that hasn’t already read the books: Don’t read further if you don’t want to know….....

No, Mercy wasn’t raped by the hero or even “one of the hero options”. She does get raped, though, and if that is a trigger for you, you might want to avoid it. (I thought it fit the plot, though)
Lyssa said on 12.09.09 at 02:53 PM • [link]

I love both the Mercy Thompson and and Alpha and Omega series by Briggs. For myself she shines in giving the reader strong female characters who are not afraid to 1. tell overbearing alpha males where to stick it, 2. know when to ask for help from those same males, without giving up their independence, 3. write shifter/were interactions with an eye to the actual dynamics of a pack, and how that might translate into human society. Her heroines might have moments of TSTL but they are few, and the type of “Oh F Me, I screwed up” moments that we all might have. They also learn. In the Alpha and Omega books, you see both Anna and Charles learning new coping skills, communication skills, and remembering what the other person has said before. All of these things make this series one I am avidly looking for future installments of. I think you will also enjoy Mercy’s story, which actually shows how a strong woman can handle a strong Alpha, and has that same ‘adult’ learning curve for the characters.
Tracy Wolff said on 12.09.09 at 03:08 PM • [link]

I’m not a big fan of werewolves, but I love this series. She does such a great job with them from book to book.
StephB said on 12.09.09 at 03:10 PM • [link]

I love this series! (And it was great serendipity to see your review today, since i just finished re-reading my way through the whole series yesterday.) One of the things I particularly enjoy is that it’s a series which isn’t scared to let the characters enter a committed relationship by the end of the first story (“Alpha and Omega”) and then focus on the development of that relationship over the course of series instead of going back and forth between different romantic possibilities. That’s one of the things that makes me strongly prefer it to the Mercy Thompson series.
joanneL said on 12.09.09 at 04:19 PM • [link]

The novella in ON THE PROWL made Anna and Charles one of my favorite couples of all time. Anna’s growth and strength just within that short story was the ‘hook’, for me, and Charles turned Alpha into a whole different creature. Wonderful writing.

I liked CRY WOLF, again because of the great writing, but, for me, HUNTING GROUND was more ‘romantic’ and showed Anna’s rise in stature in her pack and in her own estimation. Not an easy task when you’re featuring a heroine that isn’t kick-ass and accomplished with tight, strong plot and writing. And I’m so in love with Bran.

The Mercy Thompson series is 1st person and I just couldn’t get passed that.
Tae said on 12.09.09 at 05:13 PM • [link]

love both series, but I love anything Patricia Briggs has written. I’ve read all of her fantasy books prior to the werewolf stuff.

The short story/novella from On the Prowl is one of my favorites, ever. I reread it and then skim Cry Wolf. I love both series, and I really like Briggs’ take on the werewolf genre. I can’t wait for her to write Samuel’s book.
Alicia Mergo said on 12.09.09 at 05:34 PM • [link]

As far as I can say that I don’t like books where the main characters are werewolves or vampires I did enjoy this one. Patricia can write smooth and nice, her world sucked me in.
Melissa said on 12.09.09 at 05:42 PM • [link]

I love both the Mercy Thompson series and the Alpha and Omega series. Patricia Briggs is a very talented writer, I really enjoy her writing style.

I would add two things though

- First, you should read the short story “Alpha and Omega” in the On the Prowl anthology before Cry Wolf because that is where Anna and Charles’s story begins

- Second, the spoiler stated by oranghands is NOT correct. The reply by Tina C. should clear up the confusion.

The Mercy Thompson series is great too, the series are set in the same world and have instersecting characters.
Ebby said on 12.09.09 at 05:58 PM • [link]

I picked up the Alpha and Omega short and was instantly hooked on Briggs world of were/shifter characters. Strong females who have to struggle for their strength. You see their hardships and feel their pain. Its not just a bitchy attitude.

You will get hooked on Mercy.
Kati said on 12.09.09 at 06:04 PM • [link]

Oh I love the Alpha & Omega series, and I love the Mercy Thompson series. Briggs gives EXCELLENT alpha, I think, as Adam Hauptman is one of my favorite heroes of all time.

But the other thing is, the women Briggs writes are strong, sensible and remarkably balanced. It offers fantastic juxtaposition to the heroes.

I hope you like the Mercy Thompson, series, Sarah. Briggs is one of my favorite authors, although, damn, I wish she wrote faster.
Kristin said on 12.09.09 at 06:18 PM • [link]

I love the Mercy Thompson books and I will definitely have to check out these books!
Lotus said on 12.09.09 at 06:29 PM • [link]

I still linger around the “B” section of the sci-fi/fantasy nook in the bookstore even after being so negatively affected by Mercy’s traumatic experience. I still read each book immediately after it comes out, and still hope that I’ll find my love for this world again. Unfortunately, once the shiny’s come off, it’s just so easy to see the rotten bits.

I have to object strongly to the fact that Briggs constructed the werewolf world such that getting raped isn’t just yet another example of the violence that everyone in that world is more likely to experience, but a foregone conclusion for women.

To really dig the knife in deeper, not only is it pretty well expected that if you are a female werewolf you’ll be sexually assulted at some point, but there’s never any chance for any woman in this world to have any power of her own—a female werewolf can’t be alpha, and doesn’t have any real standing in the pack outside of her mate. So, for instance, even a woman who’s a good fighter compared to other werewolves and has the attitude and ability to have a high standing in the pack, even such a woman will be either dog’s meat for the male members of the pack if she’s single, or have only as much status as the male were she attaches herself to.

Such an inherently imbalanced world set in our present day becomes more and more unpalatable for me everytime it comes up.

The fact that Mercy and Anna get super special get-out-of-rape free cards by each supposedly being outside pack the pack structure AND EVEN THEY GET RAPED really just makes it that much worse.

Rape is not titillating. It does not make characters inherently more wise or more complex, and it is nothing but depressing to have this represented as the expected norm.

So why do authors, even good authors, continue to go back to this poisoned well time and again?
KristinaH said on 12.09.09 at 07:32 PM • [link]

I like the worldbuilding - that there is such a steep downside to entering the Other society - violence, lack of status for the females, rigid hierarchy… then I like watching Briggs drop in a quietly capable heroine to navigate it. But then I’m always a sucker for the underdog or, you know, wolf.
joanneL said on 12.09.09 at 07:55 PM • [link]

I have to object strongly to the fact that Briggs constructed the werewolf world such that getting raped isn’t just yet another example of the violence that everyone in that world is more likely to experience, but a foregone conclusion for women.

I’m unsure if you’re talking about the Mercy books so I can’t address that since I don’t read them, but the Alpha/Omega books don’t read, to me, like rape is a foregone conclusion.

Rape, as it’s shown in those three stories, is abhorrent to the good members of the society and as another weapon to the evil members of that society.

In these stories rape is not used for “titillation” but as a base to show what Anna has fought through and against to survive. She’s the strength that comes to the pack because of who she is and who she becomes despite the brutality of the rapes. She’s the one who will save them from themselves and the pack recognizes her for her courage and her determination.

Rape is a disturbing thing to read about, there is no barometer of what it is to go through. I do know that if the reader can’t see Anna’s rise from the ashes as a victory of body and spirit than it’s too uncomfortable a story line to follow.

There are so many wonderful books written and published that don’t contain rape scenes or discussions of rape and it’s not hard to find them among the paranormal romances.
Gerd D. said on 12.09.09 at 08:49 PM • [link]

I’m not sure naming “Lord of Scoundrels”, of all possible historical romances to be picked, is actually helping your case. :)

Because upon reading that book I couldn’t help but feel that it ticks all the boxes for what romance is often accused of.
Let’s face it, that book is nothing short of a Dear Penthouse letter, all that keeps the protagonists of the novel together is their mutual carnal longing.
Alpha Lyra said on 12.09.09 at 08:57 PM • [link]

I haven’t read the book in question, but I find it interesting and ironic that rape themes and gender discrimination apparently play a major role in werewolf fiction, because wolves are one of those lucky species in which rape does not occur (it is damn near physically impossible for a male wolf to rape a bitch) and a female can be, and frequently is, the alpha of the pack. The inability of the male wolf to sexually dominate or control the female leads to a completely different dynamic between the sexes, one much more positive for the females.

I guess what I’d rather see is werewolf romance bring in the unique gender characteristics of wolves, rather than transfer in all the awful gender problems from humankind, which are unknown and irrelevant in wolf society.

Can you tell that I think we humans (particularly females) would be better off if we’d evolved from wolves instead of apes?
Sheryl Nantus said on 12.09.09 at 08:59 PM • [link]

Mercy rocks.

‘nuff said.
Kristina said on 12.09.09 at 09:16 PM • [link]

Both series are wonderful. I haven’t been able to get into any other Briggs’ books because (I think) they are of the sword weilding dragon riding variaty. That genre of sci-fi/fantasy suprisingly enough does absolutely nothing for me.

I was so glad to see you liked this series. When I saw the thumbnail of the cover I was cringing to see how you would rip apart a book I really liked. But I was pleasantly surprised.

Maybe the dill-hole from HuffPo should have read this book before he made the generalizations he did about Romance Heros.

:-)
Tina C. said on 12.09.09 at 09:30 PM • [link]

Lotus wrote:
To really dig the knife in deeper, not only is it pretty well expected that if you are a female werewolf you’ll be sexually assulted at some point, but there’s never any chance for any woman in this world to have any power of her own—a female werewolf can’t be alpha, and doesn’t have any real standing in the pack outside of her mate. So, for instance, even a woman who’s a good fighter compared to other werewolves and has the attitude and ability to have a high standing in the pack, even such a woman will be either dog’s meat for the male members of the pack if she’s single, or have only as much status as the male were she attaches herself to.

I object to a number of the statements in that paragraph. First, I disagree that it’s expected that the female werewolves in Mercy’s and Anna’s world will be sexually assaulted. I’ve read all of the books and that just isn’t so. From what I’ve gotten from these books, the vast majority of the female supernatural beings haven’t been raped. You will also note that Mercy wasn’t raped by a were of any kind, but rather by a human who acquired a magic device and basically magically roofied her.

Meanwhile, Anna’s Alpha broke so many rules with how he treated her and the rest of the pack, it brought the Marrok’s executioner down on him—and he did so because he was trying to save his psychotic mate/wife. (Which would indicate that she had more than a bit of power over him.) If I remember right, all of the other female weres in this pack, aside from Anna, were killed or driven off because the psycho was worried that one of them would challenge her for her alpha position. As for Anna, her status as an omega and how that affected the wolves around her and what that meant to pack hierarchy, in general, and her messed up pack, specifically, had everything to do with why she was turned and then mistreated so heinously. Again, as I stated, this was presented as an aberration and beyond both the norm and the pale and ensured that they (the pack leaders and anyone that participated in the abuse) would die as soon as the Marrok found out and they knew it. Other than this specific instance, there is no indication whatsoever that single female werewolves are “dog’s meat for the male members of the pack”. The female members of Bran’s pack aren’t treated that way and neither are the female members of Adam’s pack—and those two and Anna’s original pack are the only three packs that we’ve actually spent any time with in the course of the books. So to imply that Briggs has set up a world where the female werewolves are basically sexual slaves of the males is not true and does a serious disservice to the actual text. For example, I don’t think that Mercy even decided if she wanted to be with either of the prospective heroes until the end of the second book. If this was a world where single female weres have no choice in the matter, wouldn’t one or the other of them just taken her, after fighting each other to the ground?

Rape is not titillating. It does not make characters inherently more wise or more complex, and it is nothing but depressing to have this represented as the expected norm.

If you are implying that rape is used for titillation in these books, I heartily disagree. Instead, it is shown as horrific and the victims don’t just “get over it”, even if they are telling themselves to do so. It affects their sleep and their sense of self and their ability to be with someone that they love and know won’t hurt them—in other words, it’s treated pretty realistically. Nor do I agree that Briggs uses rape as a device to make the characters “inherently more wise or more complex”. It could be argued either way as to whether or not it was necessary in the Mercy Thompson series, but given the plot, the villain, and the set-up, I felt that it was true to the book. It showed that humans can be scary and dangerous, even if you’re supernatural and don’t think that you even need to worry about someone that isn’t. It showed that it’s dangerous to underestimate someone just because they don’t sprout claws and/or fangs (or just because they don’t have big muscles and aren’t significantly bigger than you). It showed that it can even happen to smart, capable, physically-superior women. Given the rape statistics in this country, I’d say that’s pretty damned accurate. In the Alpha-Omega series, rape was a part of the abuse (along with beatings and psychological and emotional abuse) that was used to control her. The abusiveness within the pack was a part of why she was made into a wolf to begin with and lays a foundation to show her inner strength in overcoming all of that horror. (Personally, I see her ability to put that aside as much as she does and to love and to allow someone to love her in return as a triumph.) It could be read as a woman overcoming years of living in an abusive relationship. It could be read as an indictment against cultures that use rape as a weapon against their enemies and/or as a means to control female behavior. Either way, it isn’t used for titillation by any means.

If you don’t like to read anything that might have rape in it, I get that. That said, I just can’t agree with your assessment of how it’s used here.
StephB said on 12.09.09 at 09:46 PM • [link]

Yes. Ditto to TinaC.
Jazzlet said on 12.09.09 at 09:58 PM • [link]

Thanks Tina C, for expressing so clearly what I wanted to say.
KimberlyD said on 12.09.09 at 09:58 PM • [link]

*applauds* Thank you, Tina C. You said it better than I ever could and I completely agree with all of that.

I love both sets of books, although I like the Alpha and Omega series more. I’m a little over the heroine having her choice of men and refusing to choose. I have high hopes for Mercy’s series from now on, since she has chosen someone. Of course, there will be conflict and difficulty in that new relationship. But I expect that and look forward to it. I love reading about Anna and Charles’ new relationship and how they have decided to be together but still have to figure out how to make that work.
Heather said on 12.09.09 at 10:25 PM • [link]

HUGE MASSIVE SPOILERS COMING

I don’t agree with Lotus, but I see where she could think that, and it comes from one scene.

In the Mercy books (book 2 or 3), where the “reporter” turns out to be the father of a 13 yo werewolf girl, there’s a lot of discussion about where such a girl would be “safe”. Out of over a hundred alphas, the list of Alphas that Bran gives Mercy is only about a dozen or so. And “safe” obviously means being rape-free. That’s not a good ratio. And Honey has a line where she says that you (meaning a female wolf) get used to belonging to the alpha and the wolf takes over, but it’s obvious, at that moment, that she doesn’t believe what she says. There are also a few mental thoughts that Mercy has during the series that she was very lucky to have been given to Bran’s pack and not another werewolf pack, but it’s not as specific as to whether she was safe from rape or safe from being killed.

With that being said, I *love* these books. This world is a very violent place and many people die or are injured and have to deal with those injuries. I also really enjoy how the female characters deal with that violence. Instead of taking an Anita-like attitude of fighting violence with even more violence, Mercy has learned to have an outwardly docile appearance while being stubborn as a mule. Anna has remained a very gentle and caring person, but has learned that doesn’t mean that she’s weak and developed an internal core of steel.

At a con around Halloween, I got to see Briggs, and she said that she was asked for a novella from the Mercy universe and she decided off the cuff to do one about Charles. That novella was so well received that her editor wanted more, and that’s how she under up with the Alpha and Omega series. (She also said that if she had known it was going to be a series, she would have ended the novella at a different point so she wouldn’t have had to start Cry Wolf at such an awkward spot in the story.) (And she doesn’t know what the next books are going to be either. I put in a plug for a Bran book, but she says she has no idea.)
Jennifer said on 12.09.09 at 10:38 PM • [link]

Lotus does have a point to some degree: most werewolf stories may not be all about rape, but almost every darn werewolf book I read boils down to “women have no power unless they’re married to the alpha.” Women have no power even if they’re a freaking werewolf because they’re just not as big and strong as men, and so naturally they’re at risk of rape. Lovely. No wonder I don’t tend to like were-books so much.

The only two series I’ve ever read that don’t do this is Kelley Armstrong’s Otherworld and the Kitty Norville books. Kitty in particular starts out as a picked-on pack member, runs away from them, and then later comes out on top without any “oh, you can’t, you’re a woman” angst at all. Refreshing.
TKF said on 12.09.09 at 11:34 PM • [link]

Theirs is an instant-attachment between strangers. His wolf chose hers. Her wolf is down with that. He is unquestionably drawn to her, and loves her. She is horrified that she needs someone she doesn’t know very well, and is terrified of needing someone who can hurt her. Their story is about love and strength and recovery from trauma and hurt - and it’s a powerful thing to grow slowly over time.

Sounds like a “fated mate” plot/set-up, which is something that I pretty much avoid at all costs. The fact that this trope is sooooooooo common in paranormal romance is one of the reasons I don’t read more of them.
Alpha Lyra said on 12.09.09 at 11:39 PM • [link]

And that’s what I don’t get. There are plenty of venues in which to explore issues of gender inequality, but why in werewolf romance, when wolves are one of few species that do not have gender inequality? It’s as if the founding writers of the subgenre knew just enough about wolf society to know that there’s a dominance hierarchy, and then assumed that in the dominance hierarchy, males would be at the top and females at the bottom, just like in most human societies throughout history.

But it’s not like that at all. Male and female wolves do not compete directly for status. There are two separate hierarchies, one for males and one for females. Competition within the sexes (female vs. female, male vs. male) is intense, because only the alpha pair get to breed, but competition between males and females is almost nonexistent. One of the alpha pair will be the overall leader of the pack, and this is usually the male because he has a slight size advantage, but in a significant minority of cases it’s the female.

Also, wolves of low status aren’t stuck in a submissive role forever. Often they are the half-grown pups from the alpha pair’s previous litter, who stick around and help raise the next litter while gaining strength and size and experience for later. They may eventually strike out on their own, forming a new pack, or try to increase their status within the existing one as they grow stronger and the alpha pair grow older.

I know a lot of you are thinking this is irrelevant, because wolves and werewolves aren’t the same thing, and werewolves are fictional, so authors can set up their societies however they want. But why do authors always seem to choose the model of women being oppressed and powerless unless they are lucky enough to be chosen as the alpha wolf’s mate? Especially when real-life wolf society has a much more interesting model that can be drawn from.

Anyone know of any werewolf books that use the actual structure of wolf societies (separate hierarchies, equal power for males and females) as their model? Those are the books I want to read.
Lotus said on 12.10.09 at 12:24 AM • [link]

(written from work, so edited to add a few things that came up later in this discussion…)

First, I disagree that it’s expected that the female werewolves in Mercy’s and Anna’s world will be sexually assaulted. I’ve read all of the books and that just isn’t so.

And yet… why was it so important for Mercy to have been in Bran’s pack? Because he could and did protect her, when most wolves wouldn’t have (although at least in the first few books she was more worried about being killed and/or eaten). And why did everyone who heard about that new, young werewolf girl hesitate over which pack she should go to? Because only a few packs in the US could be trusted to NOT abuse her. And in the end, as I remember, the conclusion was that you just couldn’t trust a pack outside of Bran’s or Adam’s to keep a woman safe.

From what I’ve gotten from these books, the vast majority of the female supernatural beings haven’t been raped.

You betcha. Only the female weres seem to have this problem.

I remember right, all of the other female weres in this pack, aside from Anna, were killed or driven off because the psycho was worried that one of them would challenge her for her alpha position.

Her (the alpha’s crazy mate) position was completely dependent on her husband. She had no “power” outside of his (misplaced) love for her. Her jealousy of other women was seen as a sign of her unhinged mental state.

Oh, and Charles only came to investigate because of the boy who was killed. Not because rapist are punished. Bran certainly isn’t interested in sending Charles out after all those other unsafe US packs…

So to imply that Briggs has set up a world where the female werewolves are basically sexual slaves of the males is not true and does a serious disservice to the actual text.

Again, I have to go back to that young, female werewolf. It was a significant and frequently mentioned issue that if she went to ANY pack besides Bran’s or Adam’s, or maybe a few select others, she was in serious danger, and females aren’t allowed to go lone wolf. Our other example of a “normal” female were admits to making a low-status marriage in part to be safe from unwanted male attention (which she had already been the recipient of), even though Mercy estimates that if she weren’t a woman, she’d rank pretty high in the pack—in a strong, mercenary pack.

So I’d say it’s pretty clear in the text that rape is expected.

If this was a world where single female weres have no choice in the matter, wouldn’t one or the other of them just taken her, after fighting each other to the ground?

Mercy’s not a werewolf, and Adam seems to be the exception to the rule. Sam balked at physical force in his quest for a child, but is also 1) seen as an exceptional werewolf, and 2) was more than happy to manipulate the emotions of a young girl from his position as “big brother” and protector.

If you are implying that rape is used for titillation…

No, I’m not. Sorry, I probably should have been more clear. I was trying to ask what the point of including a high likelihood of being raped in any world-building scenario was. And my main point in asking that was to point out that reading about rape is Not Fun At All even when it’s dealt with in the best possible fashion, and not exactly a superior way to develop characters, and is, all in all, a pretty depressing aspect of a world to highlight and amplify.

So here you have this world where the average female involved in with the werewolves has a snowball’s chance in hell of escaping untraumatized (remember, only a few safe packs in the whole US, and probably not much more in the rest of the world). But wait! You have not one but two females with a much better than average chance of making it thanks to innate abilities that allow them to NOT have to submit to being abused by higher ranking pack members. Since their eventual reward for being both strong and born gifted is also eventual rape, rape that is nearly impossible to overcome even with tremendous strength of character and armies of supporters, what chance does a normal woman ever have (even a female werewolf)?

To me, this world just reinforces the soul-destroying idea that not only does it suck to be a woman, but that nearly all men (who are all superior) are out to force you to fulfill their need for sexual gratification and power, and that if you don’t find yourself one of the 5 extraordinarily good and extremely powerful men out there to keep you safe, your only choices are to be used and abused until they don’t even want you for that anymore. Or to die.

No, I need that hope for a better future. I need a truly happily ever after.
Katherine C. said on 12.10.09 at 12:28 AM • [link]

Patricia Briggs is one of my favorite authors, and these two series are great examples of what a fantastic author she is and what she can do with her characters. Glad you enjoyed Anna and Charles, and I know you’ll love Mercy and company too, or at least I did.
Heather said on 12.10.09 at 12:43 AM • [link]

I don’t know much about “real” wolf culture and interaction, but I agree that a series based upon the premise that werewolves have the social structure of wolves would be interesting to read. Well, at least the first one. It would still need good characters, plots, etc.

To the point that Anna and Charles are fated mates ... it really doesn’t read that way. There are no magically appearing colors, no marks appearing, no man beating the woman upside the head and dragging her back to her cave where she will of course live HEA… (again, MASSIVE SPOILERS) With Anna and Charles, there are actually four lead characters, Charles and his wolf (who becomes almost a fully realized character in his own right) plus Anna and her wolf. The wolves are much more practical. Brother Wolf realizes that Charles isn’t happy in his life, here’s an Omega who will help him, so he (the wolf) is going to mate and let the human half get with the program later. Anna’s wolf is certainly up for that, as well. In a weird way the wolves play matchmaker and thrust them together to see if they can work it out. It certainly helps that there is an (almost) instant attraction there, but Anna and Charles, due to their backgrounds, probably would have messed it up themselves if left to their own devices. The wolves helped. (Note: none of this is specifically spelled out, but as the story unfolds that’s the gist I get from it.)
Patti said on 12.10.09 at 01:01 AM • [link]

Every writer of werewolf fiction has different characteristics they give to their werewolves.
Werewolves are NOT wolves. They are humans who have been changed (for the most part - see Charles Cornick) FROM human. So are they going to think like real wolves?
No
No.
No.
Further, most people writing werewolf fiction have neither time, inclination, or need, to read the most up to date research on the true social dynamics of real wolves.
Most, in fact, are working from mythology and their imaginations FAR more than they are truth.
(as a side note, and example, I read about how dogs, in mating, have a “tie”, where the male member literally swells at the tip so it can not be removed from the female’s vagina until it collapses, after he has ejaculated. I made this characteristic instrumental to a scene in a story I was trying to write about a were-tiger, only to discover that it doesn’t happen to cats, especially tigers, who also do not have a fixed mating season, but can come into heat at any time of year. Nevertheless, in my story they do, because that’s what I need in that world.)
And rape is seldom about sex. There is a good sized discussion thread on the subject on Patricia Briggs’ Board, Hurog.com
Males do rape other males, although usually - in Mercy’s world, anyway - not male werewolves.
Check statistics on reported real life rape, and understand that it is NOT ALL REPORTED. Then tell me that it’s exaggerated in Mrs. Briggs writings without contradicting that real life fact list.
Tina C. said on 12.10.09 at 01:24 AM • [link]

From what I’ve gotten from these books, the vast majority of the female supernatural beings haven’t been raped.

You betcha. Only the female weres seem to have this problem.

On a personal note, I can’t stand “you betcha”. It’s a bit too condescending folksy, but that may be me projecting from the most famous use of that here lately. As for I used “female supernatural beings” instead of werewolves, it was because Mercy isn’t a werewolf. Kind of think you know that. Annnnnyway….

And yet… why was it so important for Mercy to have been in Bran’s pack? Because he could and did protect her, when most wolves wouldn’t have (although at least in the first few books she was more worried about being killed and/or eaten).

Because she’s coyote and not wolf, most of the wolves wouldn’t have accepted her, not because she might have been raped. As for the young girl werewolf, I have absolutely no memory of her at all, so I’d have to re-read the book to even answer that one so I guess I’ll leave it as a point to you.

Oh, and Charles only came to investigate because of the boy who was killed. Not because rapist are punished.

I think you’re reading into more than is there. He didn’t even know about what was going on in that pack until the boy was killed and then all he knew was that the boy was killed. It’s not like the Marrak said, “Oh, I thought they were just beating and raping women, so I didn’t bother to say anything but now that a boy is dead….” Once Charles found out, he didn’t just intervene because he thought she was hot—he was sickened, as was the Marrak. Okay, colossal FAIL that the Marrak doesn’t know what’s going on in all of his packs, but still, I didn’t get the sense that he just blew off all that was going on until a male werewolf hit the ground.

Since their eventual reward for being both strong and born gifted is also eventual rape, rape that is nearly impossible to overcome even with tremendous strength of character and armies of supporters, what chance does a normal woman ever have (even a female werewolf)?

You know, I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. I simply do not take that away from these books when I read them. I don’t take away what Alpha Lyra said about all of the women in all of these books being oppressed and powerless, either. Frankly, if what I was getting those things from these books, I wouldn’t want to read them, either.
TKF said on 12.10.09 at 02:02 AM • [link]

Check statistics on reported real life rape, and understand that it is NOT ALL REPORTED. Then tell me that it’s exaggerated in Mrs. Briggs writings without contradicting that real life fact list.

So because rape happens in the default world no one has the right to say that the way it’s used as a major factor of the worldbuilding here bugged the crap out of them? Sorry, but I’m going to have to disagree. I’m certainly not saying Briggs doesn’t have the right to build her world any damn way she pleases, but readers also have the right to say her choices disturbed them and led to them not liking the books.
Alpha Lyra said on 12.10.09 at 02:04 AM • [link]

To be clear, I haven’t read this series. My comments were based on what other people have said, and a general frustration with the werewolf romance subgenre. For all I know, I might enjoy this book—it’s hard to tell when different people seem to be getting very different things out of it.
Lexxie Couper said on 12.10.09 at 02:19 AM • [link]

Argh!!! Once again, I can’t buy these books to read on my iphone due to geographical restrictions! Seriously, I just don’t get it.

So, because I can’t buy it as an ebook, I probably won’t buy it at all because by the time I get into an actually “paper” bookshop, I will have forgotten all about it!

Again, I say ARGH!!
Tina C. said on 12.10.09 at 02:22 AM • [link]

I’m certainly not saying Briggs doesn’t have the right to build her world any damn way she pleases, but readers also have the right to say her choices disturbed them and led to them not liking the books.

I agree. Frankly, readers have a right to not like any book for any reason. I have to say, though—and it’s probably because I haven’t really seen a discussion of her books prior to this beyond the “oh, I LOVE that book” aside that I’ve seen here and there in regards to specific titles—this is the first time I’ve ever even seen anyone argue that rape is a major part of the world-building in this particular universe. I guess that this is an on-going argument on her website (?), but I don’t really go to many author websites since I tend to find that I enjoy the books a lot more when I don’t know much about the authors. (Same goes for actors.)

Out of curiosity, have you read her earlier books? They are much more SF/Fantasy than the Mercy Thompson and Alpha/Omega books. I found Briggs from those earlier books and read these because I just loved her writing style and voice.
Lotus said on 12.10.09 at 02:32 AM • [link]

On a personal note, I can’t stand “you betcha”. It’s a bit too condescending folksy, but that may be me projecting from the most famous use of that here lately.

Not that it matters, but you’ve stumped me here.

As for I used “female supernatural beings” instead of werewolves, it was because Mercy isn’t a werewolf. Kind of think you know that. Annnnnyway….

Possibly you could have picked up on the fact that I recognized this when I said “Mercy’s not a werewolf”. But even though Mercy’s a skinwalking coyote, and so far as we know, the only one of her kind, she does belong to a werewolf pack. And other supernaturals in that world don’t seem to have the extremely high frequency of rape.

Once Charles found out, he didn’t just intervene because he thought she was hot—he was sickened, as was the Marrak. Okay, colossal FAIL that the Marrak doesn’t know what’s going on in all of his packs, but still, I didn’t get the sense that he just blew off all that was going on until a male werewolf hit the ground.

No, I agree that the investigation didn’t have anything to do with the gender of the were who was killed. But I don’t think that either Bran or Charles would have intervened if they just suspected that one of the female weres was getting raped. Since I believe that Bran’s character is practical rather than simply uncaring, the only way I can rationalize him NOT intervening and cleaning house in all those other packs that just aren’t safe for a woman is if it would simply be a fight that no one could win. Otherwise, why not save Honey and all the other women under his rule?

Which brings us back to world building.

You know, I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. I simply do not take that away from these books when I read them. I don’t take away what Alpha Lyra said about all of the women in all of these books being oppressed and powerless, either. Frankly, if what I was getting those things from these books, I wouldn’t want to read them, either.

Fair enough. Really, I do understand why you enjoy the books, and please believe me when I say that I do too… except for this one issue. I think Briggs is a great writer with very compelling characterizations who’s brought a number of facinating elements together in the world of Mercy and Anna. I love reading about Zee, and Mercy’s business, and exploring the rest of this world is great. It’s just that after first Anna, then Mercy, then Honey and all female werewolves with rape as the expected norm, I’m having trouble finding the happy.
Theresa said on 12.10.09 at 02:49 AM • [link]

While not a werewolf romance, Tanya Huff’s Blood Trail (2nd or 3rd in her Bood Series) features a pack of werewolves living in Canada that has a pack structure quite similar to what has been described as wolf-pack structure.
SylviaSybil said on 12.10.09 at 04:08 AM • [link]

I did see plenty of male on female dominance as part of the world-building—not rape specifically, but it’s pretty well spelled out that females aren’t allowed to go lone wolf, can’t hold rank, etc., etc.. However, I saw this series as taking place in a time of transition. Remember that the werewolves who survive their first decade can live for centuries. Given that men survive the Change more frequently, the rules of werewolf society are written by men from centuries ago. So we’re dropped into a world with some pretty oppressive laws. However, as the series progresses, we see their society gradually change.
-
Warren, Adam’s third in command, is gay. Most werewolf packs would never accept a gay man into the pack at all, let alone let him hold rank. Warren is accepted mainly because the wolves in Adam’s pack are all young, only a few decades old. They don’t have centuries-old prejudices to overcome. The change for women is coming more slowly, but it is coming. In the first book Mercy says she should have been born a werewolf because she would drag them into the twenty first century kicking and screaming. Both Bran and Adam know that she doesn’t automatically obey their orders, and they try to respect her independence. Adam admires Honey’s strength and he trusts her with jobs he doesn’t trust to some of the men in his pack. Just off the top of my head, he sends Honey to bodyguard Mercy, but his second in command Darren isn’t in that rotation. In the next few books we should see even more change as Mercy asserts her authority.
LiJuun said on 12.10.09 at 05:46 AM • [link]

I loved these books so much, but I must admit that I love the Mercy Thompson books even more . . .
Muneca said on 12.10.09 at 06:00 AM • [link]

I agree with Lotus here she articulated everything that bothered me after reading Iron Kissed. The use of rape in these series while never spoken about directly is heavily implied and Lotus did a good job listing the examples and just to add one more in Cry Wolf when Sage talks about her past and the reason she transferred to Bran’s pack she too doesn’t come out and say she was raped but the words and tone of voice does imply rather heavily that she was raped by her previous pack and she moved to Bran’s pack to escape that.

For those of you that don’t remember, Sage is the ware Bran sends to protect Ana after the funeral so that Sam can treat Charles’s wounds. Sending Sage was the only way to calm Charles enough for him to get treatment. She also hung out with The Moor who was tweaking Charles tail over Ana and whose dead mate was an Omega to.

SylviaSybil while Adam is more progressive then other wolves by his choice of best friends Warren and mate he is still a ware. Also Adam’s pack isn’t younger in fact some are older then Adam they just aren’t dominate enough to challenge him. Warren for the most part isn’t accepted by his pack and is in fact challenged whenever possible; it is by Adam’s will and his will alone that allows Warren to remain pack. Should Adam ever fall you better believe the first thing that will happen to Warren is that he will be kicked out. Remember Paul? Nor is he alone in his belief remember when Adam made Mercy pack, Warren stayed with her and didn’t show his face because his presence would have made things worse for Adam as he dealt with the fall out of bringing a non wolf into the pack.

Also Adam sent Honey and the other women to play body guard with Mercy not so much because of his progressive tendencies but because he was in the middle of the mating dance and he couldn’t stand sending any males to protect her his wolf wouldn’t allow that and Mercy understood it. He only allowed the females, Warren, and Ben (who at the time she hated) because they were no threat to his claim on her.

So while yes Adam admires Honey’s strength even Adam isn’t perfect but that’s Ok because Mercy is more then able to handle him and get around him. It’s that talent that attracted him to her so he understands his own shortcomings and is trying to overcome them for her and that’s why I love him so much.

But Adam is the exception to the typical werewolf not at all the norm if we go by what different female wares have hinted on here and there.
Katie said on 12.10.09 at 06:46 AM • [link]

The YA book Blood and Chocolate also has a similar sounding wolf-pack structure to what you’ve described. It’s also just an all-around good book. It’s one of my favorite comfort reads.
Katherine C. said on 12.10.09 at 07:23 AM • [link]

Essentially, what Tina C. said. I’ve resisted the urge to respond thus far, as I don’t feel I have anything intelligent to add to the arguments she already has made — she’s said it all and better than I could have. I do just want to observe that it’s almost like some of us are reading two different series here, because our interpretations of what has been said — and unsaid/implied — are so totally different, perhaps because of different life experiences? I don’t know. What I love about this site, though, is that despite two such disparate views, those on both sides have been able to argue their points (and quite well, I might add; I’ve certainly been given some interesting food for thought) without resorting to name-calling, bashing or the junior-high “Oh yeah, well I’m right and you’re an idiot because you can’t see it” that is so common in these kinds of debates. So kudos to the Smart Bitches for the ability to be clever and sometimes snarky, but not acutally bitchy.
Suze said on 12.10.09 at 07:32 AM • [link]

But why do authors always seem to choose the model of women being oppressed and powerless unless they are lucky enough to be chosen as the alpha wolf’s mate?

My guess is because we’re working through our shyte human model, trying to figure out our own power structures that are often invisible to us until somebody points them out to us.

Anyone know of any werewolf books that use the actual structure of wolf societies (separate hierarchies, equal power for males and females) as their model? Those are the books I want to read.

I totally second Blood and Chocolate, by Annette Curtis Klaus. The alpha’s mate is the one who wins the bitches’ match, after the males fight it out for supremacy.

So here you have this world where the average female involved in with the werewolves has a snowball’s chance in hell of escaping untraumatized

ALL werewolves were traumatized in the process of becoming werewolves. The only born werewolf in Briggs’ world is Charles, every one else was made, and very often through violence.

Briggs’ characters in all her books often go through horrific events. It’s one of the things I appreciate about her writing. Often, in paranormal romance and fantasy, the big bad scary guys are really not all that scary. Vampires are hot, immortal guys with fangs. Werewolves are hot guys who shapechange. Demons are hot, shapechanging, magical guys. I like a lot of stories with those kinds of characters, but they do tend to lack substance.

In Briggs’ worlds, evil people and beings are truly evil, and do evil things. The good guys win, but not without experiencing some truly harrowing events, as befits the evil and power of the bad guys.

I didn’t like the rape scene, but it completely fit the story and the character of the rapist. I’m deeply satisfied to see Mercy and Adam, and the pack, work their way through the aftermath of the rape.

You betcha

I have to say, when I saw Tina Fey doing Palin for the first time, I hadn’t seen any actual Palin footage. I had no idea until much later that Fey was basically quoting her verbatim. I, too, find the phrase annoying now.
SylviaSybil said on 12.10.09 at 08:04 AM • [link]

Muneca, in Bone Crossed when Adam admits a new member to the pack without telling anyone in advance, Mercy mentions that his pack is composed of young werewolves who are used to American democracy, not the typical werewolf monarchy. Some of them may be older than him, but not by much. Paul hates Warren, and he’s not the only one, but the feeling is not unanimous. If Adam was killed or overthrown, Warren might stay or he might be booted. I don’t think it’s a foregone conclusion.

Alright, I will admit that Honey’s being sent to bodyguard was mostly inspired because of her gender. But why send Honey and not Aurielle or Mary Jo? Because Honey is a good fighter and a dominant wolf, and he needed someone he could trust to watch Mercy’s back.

Most werewolf packs are pretty rough on their females. But they’re not all bad. There’s a throwaway line in Alpha and Omega (in On the Prowl) when Charles says that Leo had to kill all the werewolves in his pack that were strong enough to stand up to him, because all of them fought him over the murders of the females in the pack. And again, I think their society is in a time of change and social upheaval. The fey come out of the closet. The weres follow them out. For the first time in history, entire societies of mundane humans are aware of the supernatural.
orangehands said on 12.10.09 at 09:59 AM • [link]

Thanks for clearing up my misunderstanding. I actually like when books explore rape and rape culture (for example, Anne Bishop’s Jewels Saga, which shows the way both society and individuals are committing it, both genders can and are raped, and the long term effects of rape on both society and the self.); I, however, don’t like when rape is between H/H and then we are supposed to forgive the hero instead of wanting to send him to jail for the rest of his life, which is what I was told had happened in Mercy’s story.

Very interesting discussion. This is actually sparking my interest in reading the Mercy series and seeing how I see it. (Um, if that made sense.)

Alpha Lyra: It’s also weird in the sense that in about half the werewolf stories I’ve read, female werewolves are rare to nonexistent, much less have their own hierarchy. And I could third Blood and Chocolate by Annette Curtis Klause, which shows both the separate hierarchies, and that the alphas become mates. (I read this about ten years ago and don’t remember loving it, but IIRC it was an okay book; a different kind of werewolf society, for sure.)
Overquoted said on 12.10.09 at 10:20 AM • [link]

I’m actually unimpressed. But that has more to do with the fact that I was reading Patricia Briggs’ books before Mercy ever hit the shelf (I even have a copy of her very first book that I bought for about $1.50 5-6 years ago). When she wrote the first Mercy book, I was thrilled. (I did werewolves and skinwalkers.) She ended up on the top of my favorite author list. And then was removed with the third book (which if I recall, came out around the same time the novella beginning of Anna’s series did). I’ve nothing against rape in books, I even think it works fine within Anna’s story. But that book changed Mercy’s entire personality. And as far as I’m concerned, there is no such thing as a tough, independent, strong female character who lets violence, even intimate violence, change the core of who she is.

So, essentially, I’m raging because the author’s characters are now identifiable by their rape victim status. And seriously, why the fuck are both her best-selling characters rape victims? ONE wasn’t enough?

Feh. Iron Kissed ruined the Mercy series for me, and now I just can’t enjoy Alpha & Omega.
Teresa D'Amario said on 12.10.09 at 03:12 PM • [link]

Well, I have to disagree with alot that’s been said here about wolf interaction.

First, it’s not only the alpha pair who mates. It’s the alpha female who mates. She chooses her mate based on his skill as a hunter and his strength so it appears at first glance as if #1, he’s always the alpha male, and #2, that they are monogomous. Neither is true. From time to time a female has been known to mate with a non alpha male in the pack. She will tease and entice the males into fighting to ensure she chooses wisely. She will then torture the male of her choice, who gives in to all her greatest desires (Makes me wanna be a wolf). Mating in wolf pack life is the female’s choice. The misinformation is perpetrated from old scientific research and needs to be corrected. DNA and appropriate monitoring of wolf packs has proven the monogomy and alpha breeding pairs to be inaccurate. Yet still I visit wolf research which continues to say they are monogomous. They are MOSTLY monogomous, due to the “nature of the beast”. But she can choose any mate she wants from year to year.

It’s true that wolves do not compete among the sexes for equality - there are two distinct lines. Male. Female. What most don’t realize is often the female is also the most aggressive of the two. While both are very protective, females are much more “volatile” when it comes to the frequency of challenges to be the alpha, most likely caused by the desire to breed.

There are some differences based on the BREED of wolf as well. For instance, in the Arctic wolves of Alaska and Canada, the male will give up all his food to ensure the survival of the female and pups. He’ll starve before he takes their food. This is especially true in single family packs rather than the large packs. (1 Male, 1 female and pups being the only ones in the pack) The Alpha male of the red wolf society in NC will never allow another to eat until he’s had his fill. Two different breeds with two totally different leadership styles, most likely based upon the availability of food and hunting styles.

While it’s true, werewolf society, per most authors, is often based more on lore than true wolf society, it is not true of all authors. There are several out there who do use true wolf behavior in their books. I don’t think it’s fair to say that people dont’ have the time to research. It may be they don’t have the inclination, because their world already has come to them and that’s what they are going to use, just as the vamp authors often have a bit of “lore” in their books (allergy to sunlight, etc). The nice thing about shifter authors is they do truly have as many “World rules” they can play with as any other paranormal field, so there is more realm of possibility.

I also find, in most books, the authors (myself included) tend to lean toward writing only about the alpha pairs, or tend to include alpha characteristics in their characters even if they are not alpha. This is not due to a lack of knowledge of true wolf behavior, but a knowledge of their market. Most paranormal romance readers don’t read shifters because they wanna read about lowly Omega wolves. They want to read about power, strength and loyalty of the Alpha. They want to read about the true animal connection that resides in every person, but is pushed down by society.

One author who belies this “tradition” is Terry Spear, who has successfully dealt with non-alpha pairs in her books.

As for the rape issue - rape doesn’t occur in real wolf society. Rape is a very HUMAN crime. The key to writing shifters of any type is the blending of animal and man instincts and behaviors. Animals don’t rape because sex is not a part of their “punishment”.

No 2 authors blend the traits the same. Are they animal only when shifted? Do they retain their animal characteristics in human form? Do their human chracteristics override the animal ones? It’s all up to the author how he or she deals with the merging.

All that being said, I guess it’s time for me to check out Cry wolf. I haven’t read it yet. :D
Alpha Lyra said on 12.10.09 at 06:13 PM • [link]

Rape is a very HUMAN crime.

Not strictly true. Many animal species commit rape. Chimpanzees and mallard ducks are two notorious examples. You are correct, however, that wolves do not rape.
Alpha Lyra said on 12.10.09 at 06:33 PM • [link]

Oops, I misspoke. Not chimpanzees. Orangutans.

It’s early and I haven’t had my coffee yet…
Teresa D'Amario said on 12.10.09 at 06:38 PM • [link]

LOL You may be right. I am not up on my orangutangs, though even my dog refuses to watch apes/monkeys on tv. They are just vicious! He loves all animals, and watches tv almost as much as my husband does, but when a bunch of chimps were fighting one day, he got up, turned his back on the tv, and plopped down as if to say “Mom, change it”.

Luckily I don’t write about ape family - not my cuppa. :D
TKF said on 12.10.09 at 07:18 PM • [link]

Out of curiosity, have you read her earlier books? They are much more SF/Fantasy than the Mercy Thompson and Alpha/Omega books. I found Briggs from those earlier books and read these because I just loved her writing style and voice.

Loved her older stuff (esp The Hob’s Bargain and Dragon Bones), but I gotta say I’m on the same page as Lotus when it comes to the Mercy Thompson series and it’s newest spin off (which I haven’t read).

My mother and best friend love them. Though my Mom’s now pissed that I “ruined” them for her by pointing out the rape issue.
Roslyn Holcomb said on 12.10.09 at 07:57 PM • [link]

Before I read Alpha & Omega I hadn’t read any Briggs’s books. After that I went on a Mercy Thompson glom. I enjoyed A&O better than Mercy, and that makes sense since it is more of a romance than the other. I have one problem with both series and it’s not the rape issue; it’s the way she treats minority characters. In Mercy I was mildly annoyed by the way she refers to Darren’s ethnicity every time she mentions him, but it wasn’t enough to make me stop reading the series, I generally just skipped that. In Strange Brew, it’s the same thing with Alan Choo, and I’m not even going to comment on why the one submissive in the entire pack just happens to be a Chinese male.

Then in Hunting Ground, she had an old black man singing “Mr. Bojangles” and tap dancing. I still love the book, she’s a great writer, and I almost hesitate to mention this because I’m sure that this is not intentional, but that just pushed me right over the edge. So, now I’m at a quandary; I will probably continue reading both series, but it’s almost like watching a horror movie with your hands up over your face. You know something really bad is going to happen, but you can’t stop watching it.
robinjn said on 12.10.09 at 08:54 PM • [link]

I have read, and greatly enjoyed, everything that Patricia Briggs has written. Her characters are interesting, well-rounded, and realistic.

I totally disagree that the books are all about rape of the female characters as some have implied. They DO have various explorations of what it means to be helpless. To me, Mercy’s rape scene is less about rape, and more about what happens when something terrible occurs which you have no control over. It’s also about how Adam feels. It’s his helpless rage *and* her helpless rage.

A lot of Mercy’s character is based in her great fear of being subsumed and dependent on anyone, which is why she has always avoided Adam. It’s a big issue with them both. So in that book, Briggs proposed the question of what happens when something happens that does leave her unable to be independent? Where do we go from there?

Mercy, in this last book, is affected by her rape and it has changed her. I would find it far more disturbing if it didn’t affect and change her. But she is finding her balance and learning how to refind herself. And she is refusing to be a victim and still refusing to be dominated. I like that, very much.

As for the “fated mates” trope in A&O, I hate it in traditional romances yet had no problem here. Because it’s not like they stare at each other, say “we’re fated!!” and that’s it. It’s more like, “holy crap, my wolf is saying hubba-hubba to your wolf, how do we make them stop?” Neither of them is exactly thrilled with the concept of the whole fatey-matey thing and they struggle to deal with it and to find out if they can like each other and trust each other as humans.

For Briggs fans, if you haven’t yet read Hob’s Bargain or the two Dragon books; Dragon Bones and Dragon Blood (in that order) they are really good. I loved Ward of Hurog, a man who had been so severely abused as a boy by his father that he has learned to cultivate the impression he is mentally retarded, and indeed one of his beatings was so severe as to kill most of his magic. So maybe Brigg’s themes are far less about rape and far more about dealing with and recovering from some terrible life experiences.
TKF said on 12.10.09 at 10:59 PM • [link]

As for the “fated mates” trope in A&O, I hate it in traditional romances yet had no problem here. Because it’s not like they stare at each other, say “we’re fated!!” and that’s it. It’s more like, “holy crap, my wolf is saying hubba-hubba to your wolf, how do we make them stop?” Neither of them is exactly thrilled with the concept of the whole fatey-matey thing and they struggle to deal with it and to find out if they can like each other and trust each other as humans.

But what you’re describing IS the trope. If the “fated mates” don’t resist, you have no book. The books are pretty much always, in my limited experience, about two people forced to be together by *insert irresistible magical/paranormal reason here* (I think the only use of this that ever worked for me was ElfQuest, and that might have been because I was prepubescent at the time). It’s the marriage of convenience/necessity trope turned up to 11.
jarant said on 12.10.09 at 11:02 PM • [link]

I really appreciate Briggs as an author work BECAUSE her female characters suffer sexual assault. (hang on, let me explain) It seems to me that while movies, television shows, and yes books, depict a lot of violence against women, almost all of it ends with the heroine getting away before she is Officially Defiled. Which is great, don’t get me wrong, I’m not about celebrating violence against women. But by constantly “saving” the woman at the last minute, we are given the message that being assaulted is so awful we see it, can’t visualize it, can’t talk about it. And getting raped doesn’t happen to heroines, of course, because they are too beautiful/virtuous/athletic, whatever, to ACTUALLY suffer that kind of assault. If heroines always escape The Fate Worse Than Death in popular culture, what message does that send to women who didn’t escape, who are survivors of assault? I understand why popular writers and directors want to offer the Happy Ending, they are ultimately trying to offer happy brain candy to their audiences: “Bad Things happen but not the Worst Thing, so it’s all ok! HEA for everyone!” But this is disingenuous and damaging, I think it really reinforces the shame that exists around sexual assault. I like Briggs’ writing because she goes there: both rape AND recovery. It’s not The Fate Worse Than Death. It’s awful and it’s horrible and it’s traumatic but her characters keep living. They experience assault and then the continue with their lives - trying to work out how to love and live and survive after trauma. (I read her before discovering SBTB and waaay before learning there was such a thing as rape-trope within romances. Also, I realize that rape is dealt with in very gritty, realistic ways in many books and movie and television shows. I’m referring only to my experiences with POPULAR fiction and literature.) To summarize, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I found Briggs offered the most responsible depiction of rape I had ever come across. And, even if I didn’t love Mercy and her sexy wolf-men, I really respect Briggs for that.
Has said on 12.11.09 at 01:51 AM • [link]

I think the way the rape was handled in Iron Kissed was sensitively done. Yes it was difficult to read, but the aftermath was heartbreaking and very poignant. And I agree with the poster who commented about Mercy’s fears of dominance issues with Adam. I am going to mention some spoilers below - so beware!

Another thing to take note is that the Mercy series is Urban Fantasy - and if you think about it there are a quite a few female characters who have been raped in the subgenre. From Kitty Norvill to Jo from the Weather Warden series. Whether thats a trope that is carried on from fantasy, or its something that has evolved in UF… I don’t know.

I think some UF series deal with the subject well while others I felt it was glossed over, or didnt factor in the emotional aftermath really well. In Mercy’s case I think it felt too real and that has affected some readers, and I can understand that. But I really think it has made Mercy’s character much stronger. And in Mercy’s world, it’s real and it’s violent. It deals with monsters who do not always grow fur or fangs.

There are also males who have been abused and raped too. The end scene in Iron Kissed showed there are different types of rape.

I think with the wolf packs in the Mercyverse, its more about sexual poilitics and dominance issues than about rape in wolfpacks. Also in this world its very rare for women to be werewolves, so you have to add that into the equation. Its definitely going to be difficult for women to assert themselves in packs.

Although its interesting with the quirks - regarding females taking their positions with their mates. Although they could be less dominant or more so in the pack hierarchy. And I bet Mercy is going to have a great time with that! :D

With the Alpha and Omega series - Anna was attacked and raped by a crazy wolf. In any other situation, I very much doubt any wolf could have abused or dominated her. The pack was really unhealthy with its alpha couple and hierarchy.
Spider said on 12.11.09 at 02:31 AM • [link]

What Jarant said!

I had trouble getting through Iron Kissed, and I do wish it hadn’t happened in the storyline (but recognize that’s my discomfort/issue), but agree that it’s completely disingenuous to always have a heroine kidnapped/abducted/under the thumb of the bad guy/villain and not have something terrible happen.

You don’t always get away. You can be a 100% careful person and still not get away, much less a balls-to-the-wall heroine who keeps messing around with magic she knows stands a goodly chance of burning her ass.

I saw Mercy’s story as a parallel to GHB rapes. I actually had less trouble with Anna’s story, not because it was any less frightening. but the physical violence was something my brain could process in a way that I could not with the story anything that completely overrides your will.
El said on 12.13.09 at 01:55 AM • [link]

Coming late to the thread here…

A few comments, with spoilers.

First, to Overquoted—much of Bone Crossed is about Mercy healing from the experience in Iron Kissed. She is *affected* by it, but her core character is not drastically changed in the long term.

Second—I agree with Lotus that there’s a strong presumption that unless she’s damn lucky a female were is likely to be raped. The wolf half can handle it better; this is shown clearly with Anna, whose wolf took over and protected Anna from knowing a lot of what was going on. But it still seems to happen in many (though not all) packs.

Third—One of the things I like about Hunting Ground is the way the wolf halves and the human halves work things out. Right from the first story (and I *adored* Alpha and Omega; didn’t care all that much for Cry Wolf, liked Hunting Ground quite a bit), Charles accepts that Anna’s human half might reject him. It is NOT fated. The wolf halves are down with it, but they do NOT make it inevitable. In Hunting Ground, the human halves have already mated, but both (or all four?) know there’s more work to be done, and they do it. (I also like getting to know Anna’s wolf a bit better.)

I’m thinking that one of the problems here is that a moment happens that seems to signify “This is the new reality;” it makes for a stronger book ending, but the following book then explores it in more depth, and sometimes goes back on whatever was said.

Example—at the end of Iron Kissed, Mercy looks like she’s ready for something she shouldn’t be ready for. At the beginning of Bone Crossed, it’s made clear that the gesture at the end of IK was premature. The gesture made it clear that Mercy had chosen a healthy *direction*, but she wasn’t actually there yet.

Same with Cry Wolf—full mating takes place, but problems are NOT completely resolved; you don’t really see that until Hunting Ground, though.

(Captcha: nearly 33—yeah, right. Tell that to my knees.)
marley said on 12.13.09 at 10:33 AM • [link]

if you like Cry Wolf and Hunting Ground, you will LOVE the Mercy Thompson series by the same author, (first: Moon Called) which are just generally better put together books, as it feels as kif the author was slightly rushed writing these, anmd they turned out rather awkward as a result.
Ursula L said on 12.14.09 at 12:52 AM • [link]

For a totally different take on werewolves, if you want one, there is [Benighted/i] by Kit Whitfield. Werewolves are the majority in her story, which is told from the perspective of a non-werewolf, who struggles as part of an exploited minority that’s both somewhat feared and held in contempt. It’s a werewolf story, but with very little drawn from the commonly known werewolf mythos.

She does something equally strange with mermaids in In Great Waters.

MarieC said on 12.15.09 at 02:42 AM • [link]

I love this series! These two books are spin-off of the Mercy Thompson series and have a similar yet different feel to it.

Mel said on 01.05.10 at 10:12 AM • [link]

I mostly enjoy the Mercy books, and I’m very fond of Mercy herself. But I’m not really thrilled with how she’s set up her wolf society. But I also agree with Alpha Lyra that it would be nice to see more books about werewolfs who have wolf traits (it’s all very well to say the negative traits of most fictional werewolves are from their human side, but almost all the authors I’ve read specifically attribute those behaviors to “the wolf”).

Authors can make up whatever the hell they want to about werewolves. They can do as little research into wolf behavior as they want. But there are plenty of authors who believe in doing research and then taking their flights of fancy from that base, and those are the authors I, personally, want to read. I, personally, as a reader, would really love to read about werewolves who are more than just extra-vicious humans who turn furry (and there are plenty of books about werewolves who are born werewolves and were never human—these books have the same problems).

So, Teresa D’Amario, since you say there are books out there where the werewolves are partially based on actual wolf pack dynamics, I (and Alpha Lyra, I bet) would really love authors or titles if you can think of them. My attempts to find such so far have pretty much failed.

(It’s been a while since I read Kim Harrison, and the werewolves weren’t a big part of the stories with the exception of one lone wolf, but I remember being less irritated by their gender dynamics than usual, although I still wouldn’t call them much like real wolves. Harrison and Carrie Vaughn are the the closest I’ve come to liking werewolf portrayals, but I’m not caught up on either of them.)

Teresa D'Amario said on 01.05.10 at 05:04 PM • [link]

Hi Mel,

Thanks for the response. I can tell you four authors specifically, though I know there’s one more out there and I just can’t remember her name today. All three authors are more romance than Urban Fantasy, though I’m sure there are some UF authors who do a lot with this and I’m just not aware of them. I’m the world’s worst judge at UF books.

The first is Terry Spear. She uses a lot of wolf dynamics in hers. She combines the red wolf and the gray wolf as two separate species in her stories. http://terryspear.com/ Terry actually takes things from different perspectives, not always dealing with an alpha of the pack.

And not to “toot my own horn”, another is myself. Part of my goal when writing is to incorporate as much “animal” behavior in my characters as I can. Or should I say, highlight the human behaviors that are so close to our “animal cousins”. I tend to lean toward the lone arctic wolf’s behavior, with a healthy dose of gray thrown in. To date I haven’t incorporated much in the way of red wolf behavior. Odd since I live maybe 100 miles from the red wolves on the east coast.

The third one, I can’t recall her name, though she too has wolf dynamics. I have to admit, there’s an odd sense to it. I wish I could remember the title or author, but the heroine had escaped a doctor who’d been doing alot of medical experiments on her, and lived in the North with a pack of wolves. The hero is sent to find out if she’s rogue and dangerous or just likes to be left alone.

Nalini Singh also has some wolf behavior in hers. But I found, while I love all her work, I enjoy her cat shifters more than her wolves.

I’ll try to find that other author for you. It may come to me through the day. As far as I can remember, that was this author’s first shifter book of any kind.

Interestingly, in all three cases I mention, the world’s are set in contemporary human worlds as a subset - an entire population the humans don’t know exist. And there’s not alot of crossover with vampires or other creatures of the night - just shifters. Only in Singh’s case is that different.

One last one to mention, might be Shelley Laurenston. I just read Pack Challenge and it was my first “Wolf” book of hers. I was pleasantly surprised. While not as dark as the others I mentioned, she manages to incorporate some serious wolf behavior amid the humor. Prior to this week I’d only read her Lion books.

Check those out and let me know what you think. :)

SB Sarah said on 01.05.10 at 05:27 PM • [link]

I took a quick peek at Amazon, and Pack Challenge is 70% off and $3.60 for Kindle right now, if you’re curious.
Teresa D'Amario said on 01.05.10 at 05:33 PM • [link]

wow I can count - all FOUR authors are more romance than UF, not three. LOL. Time for my morning diet pepsi (don’t drink coffee)
Kristina said on 01.06.10 at 05:50 PM • [link]

Here is another author that I thought took alot from the actual wolf critter dynamic.

Alice Borchardt, has written several books including Silver Wolf. They are set in ancient Greece, pre roman influence i believe. I enjoyed them very much. Side note, this is the sister of Anne Rice.
Sabrina M. said on 01.11.10 at 05:44 PM • [link]

I completly agree with your grade.
Both books are awesome and I can’t wait to read more of the series.
Rose Gott said on 01.11.10 at 05:51 PM • [link]

I’m a big fan of Mercy and the Alpha and Omega series but I have been bothered by the raping of both female leads. Maybe it’s an issue in the authors life that she works out in her books. It’s often difficult to realize that the entire world isn’t screwed up a certain way when you have been a victim of violence - I have had my own issues with that. But maybe I’m reading too much into it and she has lived a happy and safe life. : )

One book that I all but threw across the room in disgust over rape and horrific a werewolf pack is Kitty and the Midnight Hour by Carrie Vaughn. In that book the nasty and mean alpha just plain rapes every female all that time. Even if it’s not violent, it’s considered his due even if the female doesn’t want him and that makes it rape. I haaaaaated that book in every way, from the spineless cringing female lead to the pack rules and the uninteresting side characters. I even read a little toward the end before returning to the library and saw that the female lead finds her spine but I did not care in the least. One of my most hated books ever!

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