I started this post on 25 October, and put it aside because I wasn’t sure what I wanted to say. In mid-October, I put Heavy D’s “Now That We’ve Found Love” on my running mix and was thinking about the song and how much I liked it (and Heavy D) while I was out one day. Heavy D died unexpectedly on 8 November at age 44, and the news headline made me remember this post and that I’d never finished it. While I’m still not sure that I made every point I wanted to make (my train of thought while out running moves long the lines of Huh. Heavy D. Romance heroes. Why not heavy D heroes? …. Squirrel! Treebranch… manhole cover. Hi doggy! …. Romance heroes. Huh? ) I am still thinking about this topic, and wanted to ask your opinion.
While listening to Heavy D tell me about how he’s found love, I got to wondering whether we’ll ever see heroes who don’t fit a physical ideal – a super hard muscular one. There are built heroes and slender heroes, but even the slender heroes, once they take their shirts off, are described in such a way that almost always mentions muscles. I’ve read runner heroes and swimmer heroes and the absolutely physically astonishing Navy SEAL heroes, whose muscles have muscles of their own. The image of romance heroes is pretty darn sculpted much of the time.
Many hero descriptions include specific mentions of broad chests, narrow hips, defined arms or abs, or all of the above. In some romances, it seems like the heroine was undressing the Incredible Hulk, what with some of the descriptions that made the hero seem larger than life.
For fun, I searched Google:Books for romance author names, like “Catherine Coulter” or “Kathleen Woodiwiss” alongside the word “muscles” and looked at the sample text that appeared.
“His muscles were well honed to a vibrant hardness.” – A Season Beyond a Kiss, Kathleen Woodiwiss, 2001.
“The full length of her thigh was pressed to the granite-hard muscles of his.” – The Flame and the Flower, Kathleen Woodiwiss, 1972.
“The shirt lay open to the middle of his muscular chest, revealing sun-bronzed skin…” – The Elusive Flame, Kathleen Woodiwiss, 1999.
“He was well made, looked to be as strong as Prince, her grandfather’s most vicious wolfhound, his muscles stark and hard.” The Penwyth Curse, Catherine Coulter, 2003.
And it’s not just the romance authors whose careers have spanned decades who I searched for. I was curious about some of the more recent popular authors, too, in my highly and completely un-scientific searching.
“His chest was pure muscle, the kind that came from fighting thoroughbred horses for mastery, day after day. Even in the waning light, she could see that his shoulders were enormous, his arms rippled with muscles as he loosely held the reins. He was turned to the side, slightly away from her, so she could see how the muscles marched down his broad back.” The Lady Most Likely, Julia Quinn, Eloisa James, Connie Brockway, 2010.
“He undid the buttons on his shirt and peeled it off, revealing a tight white T-shirt that showed off his firm chest muscles.” Something About You, Julie James, 2010.
“His chest was tanned, sculpted muscle, sprinkled with golden hairs. Not big, bulging muscles, but the muscles of someone who did physical work every day, hefting tanks around and lowering boats into the water…” – Crazy for Love, Victoria Dahl, 2010.
And of course:
“His abdomen was ribbed as if he were smuggling paint rollers under his skin. His legs were thick and corded.” Dark Lover, JR Ward, 2005.
I could keep going, but you get the point. The heroes, they are muscular. And not just Down There.
I don’t meant to call out these authors as if they’ve done something wrong in their descriptions – they haven’t. Not at all. One of the odd things is that the cover model might not match the hero’s appearance – his hair or eye color, for example – but the muscles will probably match up in strength and definition.
The funny thing about that super, possibly superhuman, physique: it takes a lot to maintain it. Yet these super-muscular heroes aren’t going to the gym in every chapter, despite the fact that keeping those hardened and sculpted leg muscles and all those washboard/paint roller/eight pairs of parked Volkswagen Beetle abs requires regular maintenance. All that gym time would cut into the wooing time. And the business time, too. (Question: Was there a Regency GNC, selling protein powders and weight gain shakes for all these heroes back then?)
Anyway, these authors are successfully writing the heroes we read about, and continue to read about, ostensibly giving us, the readers, what we want: really finely sculpted specimens of manly manhood with extra muscles of manfulness on the side (and back, and legs, etc).
There seems to be a very wide chasm between the depictions of heroes in romances, and men like Heavy D, and other men of size. Or just men of different sizes. I mean, come on, Heavy D found love, right? He sang about it (over and over and over. Seriously that song has, like, 14 repeats of the chorus). Heavy D was a stumbling, bumbling overweight lover (though I have NO idea why he’s dancing in a raincoat in that video).
And most men don’t match that described muscled ideal. Men gain weight in different places than women – often in the stomach area (though for some reason as they age, many men lose their asses. Where the hell do they go, anyway?). Most of the fathers and husbands I know are not super muscly. They aren’t physical ideals as defined by the romance genre, but they are, some of them, pretty hot. And their wives and partners and girlfriends love them.
If part of the underlying message of romance is that the hero and heroine aren’t idealized images of perfection, and are instead two people with human flaws who are perfect for each other, why are the heroes continually ripped and cut into muscled ideals? I know the muscular descriptions are ways to reinforce the virility of the hero, but are there other models of heroic proportion we could embrace as readers?
We’re seeing more heroines of different sizes, slowly but surely. Would we accept a hero who isn’t muscled and physically ideal?
I would like to think so. Have a look at this Tumblr blog of romance authors posting pictures of their real-life husbands and partners: Romance Authors Present: The Sexiest Men Alive. Some of them are truly adorable and gorgeous and funny (I love the expression on Daisy Harris’ husband’s face). But these are real men with real bodies, many without the stark hard muscles of rippling, granite-hard hardness.
So do we want to cross that chasm between the romance depiction and the shaped varieties of they actual human male body? What descriptions would we as readers welcome, and conversely, what would repel us?
Maybe SciFi/Fantasy is the testing ground for non-muscled heroes. Of course there’s tons who are built, but in addition to Miles V and my beloved Connie Willis guys, there’s Antryg Windrose from the Barbara Hambly books – he’s skinny but hot, and his books are way full of romance. Ged from the Earthsea books may not be a romance hero but I sure had a big old crush on him, and David Tennant is skinny (pardon me while I swoon over David for a while…OK, I’m back.)
@Anna the Piper—Small internets! I was a total lurker, and haven’t been on since about 2002.
I am now trying to track down your book. Bouzouki love! My Nanowrimo novel has a (very) minor character who’s a fiddler, almost entirely because of a recent encounter with a PEI fiddle player. I may expand this to a full east coast band…
@trefoil: Contact me off-thread if you want to ask about my book—my publisher has folded, unfortunately, so the only way to get it is currently directly from me. You can reach me at my gmail address, annathepiper.
@CarrieS: Yeah, I tend to see a wider variety of body types represented amongst SF/F heroes, that’s for sure. And Doctor Who is a particularly sterling example of male lead characters who are not necessarily outright handsome, but who are nonetheless swoonable for their brains and thermonuclear charisma. 🙂
I realize that I have drifted far off topic and am now referencing heroes who are not only romance-specific but are not in novels – but we’re watching Deep Space 9 right now and Julian Bashir is fit but rail-thin and turns out to be quite the hottie, and don’t even get me started on Odo. Both characters have a lot of romance-related arcs. OK, I’ll stop now!
Real men are funny, intelligent, love children and animals. Real men kiss like there is nothing else on his mind but you. Real men laugh at themselves and with you. Real men hold your hand and put their arm around you in the movies. Real men are not afraid to say “I love you”—- often.
My “real man” is all of the above, plus he loves books, all music including opera (WFH?), Disney movies and Jon Stewart. He’s also a bit overweight, bald, walks with a cane at times and is 70.
Which is OK because I’m a real woman – all of the above including chubby, opinionated, cranky at times and 64. But we love each other and that’s what “real” men and women do.
well I’m sure many women will agree that we don’t want to read about a hero with a massive beer gut, and I personally don’t care for short men, but I don’t need the abs to light my fire. I don’t need super muscly, but I definitely prefer it to scrawny, ie absolutely no arm musculature or definition. also, I wouldn’t mind if my hero was pale. and I’d actually prefer a man with chest hair, yet for years that was absent.
@CarrieS Thanks so much for mentioning Antryg Windrose. That was my first exposure to a non-standard romance hero and it opened my eyes. Would anyone else confess to a love for Abishag Shaw in the Ben January series of Hambly’s, lank hair, tobacco spitting and all?
Again this looks like a face-off between what readers want and what they say they want. Like a previous commenter, I prefer my heroes NOT have beer guts, etc. This is fantasy we are buying and writing. Readers say they want variety and reality but once it’s offered, few, if any, buy it. This goes for ANY deviation from the norm in romance novels. I recall readers wanted older heroines. A publisher put out a line with older women heroines a few years back and poof! it died. Same for interracial romance. People say they want to read it, but few really do. It’s seen as a novelty. I should know. I write it and have been told in the past by traditional publishers to be more mainstream and I may get somewhere. NO THANKS! The tiny audience I have, I like. They like me. I craft my work for me and for them. Readers make their tastes known by what they will pay for. Publishers follow those dictates. So, if you are not seeing what you want, stop buying what you don’t want just because it’s on the shelf this month.
Ok, since this seems to be in the trifecta of unattractive things along with fat and short (all my short male cousins are very cool and have really cool wives, btw, one of whom is taller than her husband), am I seriously the only woman who thinks bald is kind of hot? I’m not saying that a bald head will automatically make any guy hot, or even that all kinds of baldness are created equal. For example: receding hairlines and horseshoe-bald do it for me, bald spots in the middle of a head of hair do not, although it’s not so bad if the hairline’s almost back there to meet it. Completely bald depends on if the guy can pull it off. But really- Jose Ferrer in Cyrano de Bergerac. His son Miguel, for that matter. I wouldn’t go for Dan Aykroyd now, but in the late 70s and early 80s when he was about the age I am now, he was cute as hell and his hairline was already starting to get kind of interesting.
My best example of my type is Richard Marcus back when he was on the first season of St. Elsewhere in 1982, but the only pictures I can find of him are from the past few years since he was on 24, and almost thirty years on he doesn’t really have the same effect. But he was playing a mental patient who thought he was an eagle, and he looked like one. Not just the mental association with baldness, but the sharp features and the really piercing gaze. I’ll substitute a slightly less perfect example along the same lines, Sean Gullette in Pi:
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm387553280/tt0138704
@PJ Dean – well, I have to admit I’m as shallow as the next person, and I noticed I could think of more skinny attractive male characters than overweight, possibly because I’m more attracted to overly thin men than to overly heavy. I agree with several posters who said that when it comes to description, the less specific the physical description the better, because you can project your own fantasy onto the character. Also, it depends on what I’m reading the romance for – a romance between, say, two overweight people might be very emotionally satisfying for me but not as erotic as one between two conventionally gorgeous people.
Re older heroines, aren’t there a lot in romance now? When you say older, do you mean 30s, 40s, or 50 and up? I noticed a lot of threads on this site have sung the praises of heroines who in are in their midlife or older – Jennifer Crusie has several.
@LeslieB
I’ll see your Abishag Shaw and raise you one Hannibal Sefton. Bring on the TB, opium, and violin, baby! Love that series!
@Kristen A. Hey, you’re not the only one. Patrick Stewart was voted one of the sexiest men alive and he started losing his hair when he was 17!
I didn’t think I was supposed to be alone in thinking Patrick Stewart was hot, but the way “bald” gets tossed around as something unthinkable in a sexy guy made me wonder if I was in a smaller minority than I knew.
My boyfriend says he started losing his hair around the same age, and I wouldn’t want him to do anything to fight it. And this isn’t a Pavlov’s dog thing where I find these actors attractive because they remind me of my boyfriend, because my fondness for most of them predates when I met him.
As proof of Patrick Stewart’s ability to seduce everyone in the galaxy, I present three generations of women in my family – me, my aunt, and my grandma all had crushes on him at the same time. I think baldness is in these days, esp with African American men – Taye Diggs, Seal, etc. I think when baldness is unattractive is when men try to hide it. The comb-over is nobody’s friend.
It took me a while to adjust to the romance sexy hero, because I have never gone for traditionally handsome guys, or muscles, or height, or…anyway. More importantly, when I first starting reading romance, the heroes were almost invariably assholes, which is also not what I personally look for in a guy. But that was the pattern, and I like patterns, so (this is so counter-intuitive) I quickly found it comforting to read about muscle bound, emotionally stunted, generally loathsome rapists living happily ever after.
I’m just saying. If I could accept old-school heroes, I’m pretty sure I could be OK with short, pudgy heroes too.
@Kristen A: Jason Statham. I may be unoriginal, but holy I nominate Jason Statham to the “balding and hot” category.
@PJ Dean, you have a legit point. Audiences tend to buy what they’re used to, even if they’re asking for something else. But what if the hero’s body-type wasn’t the focus of the book? I mean, when condoms began making frequent appearances in romances, I can’t imagine people started identifying particular authors as writers of “condom books.” And now condom use is pretty standard in most contemporary romances. As long as physical imperfection isn’t the point upon which the plot turns, would readers really say, “she writes great historical romances, but I won’t buy her because her heroes are too short.”
(That should be “holy cow”. I get so excited about the Statham, I sometimes forget myself.)
@PJ
Now that I consider it, my thoughts are along the same lines as Jrant’s from the opposite direction. The reason why I say I would like to see more nerdy-cute heroes but buy and read books with muscle-bound heroes is because those heroes are in books with good dialogue and good plots by authors who really nailed the historical setting (where applicable). If those authors gave me some heroes that looked like Stephen Maturin, I’d love them even more, but I don’t base my reading decisions that much on the heroes physique. It’s an annoyance that I can live with because I can always pretend that they’re in fencer-shape and not Hulk Hogan shape and somewhat less ludicrously tall, so ultimately I’m not going to base my reading decisions on it. Likewise, although a nerdy-cute hero might be a clue that I’ll really like at least one of the protagonists, I’m not going to read a book that otherwise holds no interest for me because of one. I’m seriously considering at least reading Vision in White from the library based on the description of the hero in a previous post, but holding back because of my total lack of interest in the wedding planning angle of the series.
In short: if I’m going to buy books about heroes that look the way I’d like them to look, there are going to have to be enough of them for them to show up in some books I’d like first.
Zoe Archer wrote: For me, however, it isn’t he lionization of tall heroes that I find troubling, but the vilification and mockery of short men.
So agree with this, Zoe!
And agree with Jrant about Jason Statham. He only seems to have one facial expression, have you noticed, but heck, when it’s such a good one, why diversify?
@Lillian Darcy – LOL! Daniel Craig (*sigh*) is the same way with having only one expression that just happens to work really well. Have you noticed that all he does is have this little pouty face? And when he’s REALLY mad, his eyes narrow, and if he’s happy(ish – because he doesn’t really get to experience much happiness in his roles) his eyes get bigger. I love his expression when he shoots down a spaceship in C&A – he looks exactly like I do when someone steals my parking space.
@CarrieS LOL back. Will have to watch Daniel Craig closely in future. For research, of course.
Oh, I loved this post…I’ve told my husband, and more than once, he doesn’t have to fit some romance cover model of perfection to be perfect for me. He’s my height-5’6, and I don’t care if he doesn’t tower over me and I don’t care if he’s not roped with muscles. I know he’s got great hands, and he’s got a wonderful smile and when he laughs, it makes my heart skip. I know he’s a wonderful dad, and I know he’s perfect for me…that’s all I need in my hero.
In books? Honestly, there are some books that I just either skim or just skip the descriptions of the hero. I’m sorry-I don’t want to think about the Incredible Hulk as a dude in the book I’m reading and some of the heroes are depicted that way. That just doesn’t do it for me, personally.
@LillianDarcy – the things we do for science!
Wanted to add, to Zoe, I know a woman who is always sneering about certain men having “Short Man Syndrome.” It’s so nasty. I want to say to her, “Yeah, well you have B**ch Mouth Syndrome. The difference is, you could choose not to.” Really can’t stand it.
Ah, the unrealistic descriptions for Romance novel men (as opposed to the unrealistic looking women).
In no particular order… there does seem to be a lot of the sameness for the Romance Heroes (as discernible from ordinary men). Tall, muscles, probably rich, optional trauma in the background, likely arrogant with an option for distrustful, muscles, irritating hotness, muscles, mighty wang, irresistible sex appeal… and of course, he will be with his Heroine, with her long, luxurious tresses (color variable) that never tangle, jewel-bright eyes, tiny waist… yeah, yeah – we get it already – they look Too Perfect, and that’s how we know they are the Hero and Heroine.
The cover art (which may or may not match the text descriptions) does NOT help this idea.
…. and those generic Romance Cover Appearances just a) don’t fit most real people and b) don’t do it for everybody. Maybe she doesn’t like him to be a towering giant with the muscles of Conan, and maybe Conan over there doesn’t want a twig woman with more hair than brains?
First, I want the books to have good plot, pacing, and dialog. I want the characters attitudes and personalities to be such that I can want them to be happy instead of rooting for them to get killed or stuck in years of therapy, or asking why all their money can’t buy a personality. I believe that it should be possible to do this without cookie-cutter main characters.
Second, not everybody has the same general look that they find really attractive. Some like the guys to be tall, broad shouldered muscular manly-men. Some may prefer lean, like a runner or swimmer. Some may prefer lean and not at all brawny, like Tm Curry (during the 1990’s or 200_’s) or David Bowie. Some may prefer less hair (clean shaven, no chest or back hair), others may like them with more hair – and not just on the face. Some like their ladies taller, some shorter, some want them ‘close to my height’. Some prefer longer hair, some shorter. Some people focus more on certain parts. Some want dainty, fragile ladies, some want curvy sex-kittens, some may want their strong warrior women.
I’d prefer to feel that the character is really attracted, rather than feeling like the author is trying to make me attracted, or sharing just a bit too much about what the author wants. Don’t talk about his stone-hard muscles bulging, talk about the heroine feeling all fluttery at the water running over his arms/shoulders. Rather than gushing over his gorgeous face, describe that she wants to run her fingers over his cheekbones and nip along that infuriatingly delectable jaw. I don’t have to be the one who finds The Guy to be Hotty McHott, SHE does. Make me believe that his appearance (however much or little it’s described) does it for her.
……… Or maybe instead, he ISN’T what she normally looks for – maybe she tends to prefer taller, brawnier men, but there’s something about him that she can’t get out of her head, and that voice should be illegal, and… and… and she doesn’t want to throw him against the wall and kiss him until he stops talking….
Maybe it isn’t his looks, but the way he acts, the way he carries himself and handles things? Just for an example – Patrick Stewart (and yes, he looks quite good without hair!) his portrayal of Charles Xavier was – he was great for the role, but I couldn’t quite picture him in a romance (more the ‘I think we would suit well, it wold be a good, sensible match.. yes, quite sensible, let us be content together.’). But Captain Picard – very nice… very, very nice. I could see him being VERY popular with the assorted females around his quadrant of the galaxy… Hugh Jackman – in X-Men, Wolverine was the sort of person to avoid – too abrasive, too… no. His role in ‘the Prestige’ – everything that you should avoid and might not have the sense/willpower to keep away from. Trouble, but the sort that would be interesting. Van Helsing… let me watch, but he had so many issues that you might be safer far, far away. Probably safer far away.
And my oh my yes can I understand about him having a voice that just works. Alan Rickman has a great voice. So does Ron Perlman, though he isn’t ever going to be considered classically handsome – that voice, oh wow that voice…
It isn’t always how he’s built, how big his muscles are, or how spiffy his clothing is. Sometimes you can’t even find the right words to explain it, but… you know that you like something about the way they look. Like Sam Elliot – I don’t know why, but whatever ‘it’ is, he seems to have it.
Make me believe that when he looks at her, she’s got IT that makes him sit up and take notice. Make me believe that she’s got IT – and that IT is more than a perky, heaving bosom, full lips and glossy hair. Convince us that IT is more than Authorial Fiat for this one is the hero, not that one.
verification word: myself82 yes, I myself could point out 82 different people or roles that are ‘attractive’, and they wouldn’t all have the same build. Some actors are attractive in one role, nice to look at but just shut up and stand there in other roles, and completely uninteresting in another role.
Suzanne Brockmann’s facebook page – she has a reissue of her first romance coming out and she notes the hero is a writer “who evidently likes doing crunches”.
I don’t think she wrote him that way.
This post seemed related to this thread
http://jezebel.com/5854281/can-men-handle-being-ogled
ev said:
It all makes sense!
As for the actual question, I think I fall into the category of preferring less specific descriptions. Someone already mentioned Crusie’s description of Phin in Welcome to Temptation and I agree. It’s amazing and I knew immediately what he looked like but my idea was different to my friend’s idea and that’s fine. It’s called imagination and it’s what makes it reading and not watching a movie.
I read romantic suspense a lot, and if I find pudgy, unfit Navy SEAL, Green Beret or Force Recon guys, then I will not be happy. I also come from a family of military men with muscles, so yeah, they exist and they don’t only think about their appearance day in and day out (was it those “Real Women” who started the myth people who go to the gym have no personality?!).
Because we tend to put ourselves in the role of the heroine (which is why, I suppose, overweight heroines are on the rise), we have to find a romance hero attractive. I love nerdy guys, but don’t only want to read about nerdy guys. I have to find a man physically attractive, because a good personality alone is only a basis for a good friendship!
But when it comes to something like historical romance, well, Englishmen today are pretty small and pasty and nothing like the American romance stereotype, and they were complete dandies in Regency days. I’ve never found them appealing, and find it hilarious that every HR hero is some gigantic God with muscles in every direction – try tubby, short, balding and wearing some pretty funny stuff!
@SNFK I take it then you’re not that into Sam Axe on Burn Notice? He’s a pudgy ex-Navy Seal.
One of Lisa Marie Rice’s books (Dangerous Passion) has a hero who is specifically mentioned as being barely taller than her. Still broad shoulders, of course, but I actually liked that he wasn’t 7 ft tall, unlike her usual protagonists.