State of the Plagiarism

Isn’t it enough that you people set out to destroy her career and almost caused her death?

In case you don’t know, which I know for a fact you have been told, Cassie Edwards suffered a massive stroke due to the stress you idiots put on her. 

I hope you can live with yourselves knowing what you did almost cost this woman her life.  You have deprived her grandchildren of their grandmother.  You have caused a lot of innocent people much heartache by your actions.

Everyone is blaming you and your cronies for what happened. Not just her fans, fan club members, etc.  I’m talking publishers, authors, editors, and more.  I hope almost killing someone was worth the 15 minutes of fame.

If you have any reason to think this is a lie, contact Carol Stacy at Romantic Times and I’m sure she’ll verify the information for you.

A lot of Cassie’s fans plan on being at the RT convention in Orlando just so they can attend your blogging seminar.  Instead of it being about the art of blogging maybe it should be about the art of how to destroy a person’s life.

A few weeks ago, when Sarah realized that January 2009 would mark a year since the plagiarism scandal that rocked the ferret world, as well as the romance world, she asked Jane to examine the issue and do a “State of Plagiarism” analysis, so to speak. After much back and forth dialogue, we’ve come to the following conclusions about the way the issue of plagiarism is treated by our community. This entry is posted on both Dear Author and on Smart Bitches as a summary of our conversation.

 

On the positive side: the issue is being discussed, in the romance community, and in the larger publishing world as well. Fans, authors, and even publishers are being educated as to what plagiarism is, what enforcement mechanisms there are, and why it’s important for the entirety of the literary community to not be complacent or unsupportive.  Even if some, or even much, of the discussion is about how horribly mean we were to speak up and speak in the manner that we did, it was dialogue about an important topic that we hadn’t had before. 

The Edwards scandal was important not because of who was involved, but because it led to the further education. There was a session at RWA and one at RT.  There were mentions in the newspapers and on blogs.  There was support for the victim of plagiarism in a way that there wasn’t ten years prior, making it easier for one who is plagiarised to come forward. Plagiarism became newsworthy, and the increased attention meant that victims of prior incidents had room to speak up and share their stories, the costs both financial and emotional they endured to protect their copyright.

Even the absence of discussion was noticeable.

But the negatives are related to the positives: the session at RWA was poorly attended, and there was a backlash to those who spoke out, not so much here at Smart Bitches or Dear Author, but against others who took a stand. With the revelation of plagiarism at the hand of Neale Donald Walsch, the same old themes are played out with a full orchestra.

Those who raise the issue and cry foul, whether it’s a blogger or the writer herself, take the blame. We’re told to hush up, keep quiet, and stop being mean.

It was one year ago this week that we broke the Cassie Edwards story.  This entry isn’t in the least about her. Instead, it’s about where the writing community stands in regard to plagiarism within the genre. Based on our analysis, we haven’t made much progress. Lip service is paid to the idea that its bad, but when the excrement hits the air circulating device, there’s navel gazing and thumb twiddling and fretting and calls for forgiveness, bygones, and stop being mean already.

Little has changed in attitude and practice. Plagiarism remains an issue tried in the court of public opinion, and the more famous or published the thief is, the more likely they are to be reassured and forgiven by their eager fanbase.  Plagiarism is not an issue that can always be validated in a court case; it’s a community issue. Do we, as a community, believe in the need for intellectual honesty and creativity?

Why is there not more of a reaction to sympathize with the person whose work, inspiration, and words were stolen from them? Why is there instead pressure for the victim to shut up about it and a general attitude that the whole mess should just disappear so people can get back to reading?

In our opinion, plagiarism isn’t taken seriously enough by some readers or by some writers. The defense of the plagiarist and the ease with which forgiveness is offered by readers is so stupid as to be mindboggling. What, because they cried and said they were sorry it should be over? Remorse is enough? To quote the wizened literary scholar Rhianna: “You’re only sorry you got caught.”

Until every reader and every writer refuses to tolerate plagiarism and the thieves that commit it, it will be a problem that continues to grow. But that intolerance needs to extend to every genre. When plagiarism hit romance, the response was, “Oh, but it’s only romance novels, and they’re all the same anyway.” With the spiritual writing community, the response is, “Oh, it’s just crazy religious people who think they talk to God, so whatever.” With fanfic, it’s “Oh, it’s just fanfic.”

Plagiarism should not be tolerated anywhere by anyone, and that includes romance, spiritual writing, literary fiction, academic publication, and fanfic. It shouldn’t be tolerated, it shouldn’t be excused, and it shouldn’t be something that is kept quiet. The lack of support for those who suffer from it is appalling: from insane court costs to accusations of being a whiner, the person who has been robbed is singled out as a troublemaker who ought to pipe down. From warnings of bad publicity to being called an outright liar, the victim is again a victim.

Yet again plagiarism shows up in the news this week, and yet again the same song is played. Everyone should be vocal in making a stand and making plagiarism unacceptable within our community. The song needs to change.

Comments are Closed

  1. Ezri says:

    Jessa, I think you’re right about that one.  In the case of say, a store, when something is physically stolen, you can immediately see the impact.  With plagiarism it’s more faceless because you can’t see how the person whose words have been stolen is affected.  In many cases people probably figure that the person whose words they used will never even know. 

    Anne Fadiman’s got a great essay on plagiarism (in “Ex Libris” I believe, but I might have my essay collections mixed and it’s in her newer collection, “At Large and At Small”)  in which she talks about how her mother had her wartime correspondences nicked by someone else who then published them under his own name.  The only time her mother got to see her writing in print was under someone else’s name.  That definitely put a fine point on things in my book.

  2. Chrissy says:

    I’ve had strokes.  Numerous, actually, because of a terminal lung disease from which I suffer.  They are nobody’s “fault.”

    Perhaps years of living a lie had consequences? 

    I really don’t think any legitimate writer is worried about the opinion of a fan who rabidly defends somebody who steals the work of others and becomes belligerant and hostile when caught. 

    I don’t see this as cruel irony.  I see it as the universe tweaking her soul and asking her to pay attention.

    I hope she listens and heals soon.  No unkindness intended… the world will keep teaching you until you learn.

  3. snarkhunter says:

    The argument that you have to hostile and abrasive only serves to negate the work of strong women.

    Oh, please. There has been hostility and abrasiveness throughout this debacle.

    The funny part is that it’s largely coming from the people who defended Edwards—see the letter above for a classic example.

    Was there, perhaps, a tiny modicum of glee in finding out that the books were plagiarized? For me, I mean? Yes. I admit it. I’m probably a horrible person. But I have never felt that Edwards “deserved” an illness—just recognition of her bad acts. Same with everyone who does wrong. Apparently, if we’re not mealy-mouthed pansies, going on about how we shouldn’t speak ill of anyone, we’re hostile and abrasive. Yeah, that’s a feminist argument.

    On a totally different note, every time I see Edwards’s books in the store—or, God forbid, a display of them—I have the overwhelming urge to grab a pen and paper and stick a note reading, “This book is plagiarized” inside the covers.

    Also, speaking of the reactions of the various tribes to Edwards’s books…when the scandal first broke last year, I was home in Washington state. I grabbed the list of suspect passages Candy had sent me and ran off to the nearest library, which happens to be the library on the reservation of the S’klallam tribe. What did I find there? Two Edwards novels. (Didn’t find the plagiarized passages till after I got back to my university library, either.)

  4. SusannaG says:

    I must have been a plagiarist – I had a stroke in 2004.

  5. snarkhunter says:

    Anne Fadiman’s got a great essay on plagiarism (in “Ex Libris” I believe, but I might have my essay collections mixed and it’s in her newer collection, “At Large and At Small”) in which she talks about how her mother had her wartime correspondences nicked by someone else who then published them under his own name

    I’ve read Ex Libris (thrilled to see that she has a new essay collection, by the way!) and I thought the essay on her mother was about how her mom wrote the bulk of the book, and is credited on the title page, but the male author got the majority of the acknowledgment. Not really plagiarism so much as a sexist literary community only recognizing the contribution of the male writer. But I could be misremembering this, too. 🙂

  6. snarkhunter says:

    Snarkhunter, you’re probably right – I keep lending out my copies of “Ex Libris” and then having to order new ones, so I was posting from memory there as I’m between copies at the moment.  The part that stuck in my head was when she mentioned how her mother had to read her dispatches in a book with someone else’s name on it. 

    I’m thrilled to hear that you’re a fan too!  Definitely check out “At Large and At Small” – it’s just as good as “Ex Libris” though the topics are on more general topics rather than books. 

    Strangely when I googled to try to figure out which volume the plagiarism essay was in, I turned up an article talking about how one of Anne’s anecdotes from “Ex Libris” was stolen by another writer a la Neale Donald Walsch.  *sigh* 

    http://gawker.com/news/new-york-times-book-review/in-the-nytbr-writers-are-now-plagiarizing-about-books-246924.php

  7. Lorelie says:

    every time I see Edwards’s books in the store—or, God forbid, a display of them—I have the overwhelming urge to grab a pen and paper and stick a note reading, “This book is plagiarized” inside the covers.

    Me too! With a post it note!

  8. liz says:

    This is SO familiar to me. No, JD didn’t have a stroke, but people were appraised of and blamed for her health. Her health came up pretty quickly, as I recall. And people said the community should leave her alone and investigate how it happened. Which was impossible, because any discussion of it led to being told to leave her alone. And there were attacks on NR and those supporting her. (Ah, cane of candy, the last but not the least)

    Nothing will change. But I say to SB yes on the extra security and I say to anyone blaming the publishers – where does personal responsibility lie? If I, the author, am not to blame for the words I place on the page then who is to blame for anything? There is no malpractice, there is no theft, there is no fraud. As long as the person doing the harm is not the person responsible, there is no wrong. Red Dress theory.

    I wish CE better health, I do not wish her anything else, good or bad. As long as she writes her own books, I have no problem with her.

  9. Silver James says:

    On a totally different note, every time I see Edwards’s books in the store—or, God forbid, a display of them—I have the overwhelming urge to grab a pen and paper and stick a note reading, “This book is plagiarized” inside the covers.

    Ooh-ooh! I want those stickers. I will happily stick them ON the cover whenever I come across her books. Though…I suppose, technically, I’d be guilty of vandalism. *sigh* Oh well. I still like the sentiment even if we can’t carry it out.

  10. Lorelie says:

    I want those stickers. I will happily stick them ON the cover whenever I come across her books. Though…I suppose, technically, I’d be guilty of vandalism.

    That’s why I was thinking post it notes. If it’s easily removable, it doesn’t count as vandalism, right?

  11. kimmako says:

    If I show up at the RT convention with Savage blahblah written out longhand, can I get a contract? I’m not doing anything wrong, am I? and those women who are going to slap down SB will even help me, right?

    I did know about CE, JD, but not about Jennifer Crusie. I won’t be buying anything by her again, despite having really loved (and got another friend to buy as well!) Agnes and the Hitman.

  12. In the UK, it’s certainly illegal, and someone can be sued for breach of copyright.

    Look, you are confusing copyright violation with plagiarism.

    Plagiasism is not illegal (Except in academic situations.) You will not be fined, sent to jail or convicted of plagiarism.

    You can be fined, sent to jail or convicted of copyright violation. But usually you are sued, not prosecuted.

    If I quote Jane Eyre verbatim in large chunks in my novel, it’s not copyright violation, but it is plagiarism.

    If I write fanfiction about Stargate Atlantis, it *might* be a copyright violation but is almost certainly not any kind of plagiarism as I am not using other people’s words and pretending they are my own.

    Sometimes plagiarism is also copyright violation, and sometimes it’s not. In Edwards’ case, we have both situations.

    Can we, after a year of discussing this, try to keep the two concepts straight? It doesn’t help when we don’t even understand what we’re complaining about.

  13. Actually, I saw a fair amount of commentary about the racism in her books on some livejournal communities like Deadbrowalking and DebunkingWhite.  Just because no organized protest was made doesn’t mean nobody noticed.

    And going by past behaviour in the romance community, if someone *did* point it out, then someone else would wheel out a Native American who wasn’t bothered by it, to justify it and slam anyone who was upset. Then the original complainant would be accused of not being Native *enough* for their words to matter, and the whole thing would end with that person being accused of being a racist for even mentioning it in the first place.

    And then some other person, who lives to stir shit, would say, why didn’t the Native American complain about the way Muslims are portrayed in all the Sheikh stories, and at that point, the Native American who has been trying to raise consciousness over and over about the tokenism and misrepresentations of minority cultures, will realise that white people don’t bloody care about these issues at all, they just love to get their digs in so no one will never take real problems seriously. And then the Native American decides trying to educate idiots is a waste of their time and energy.

    Certainly what happened during the Jewel of Medina thing, and during the matter raised oh so innocently above.

    Mind you, educating idiots about anything tends to be an exhausting and futile business, as the SBs have found over the plagiarism business.

  14. Grrrly says:

      every time I see Edwards’s books in the store—or, God forbid, a display of them—I have the overwhelming urge to grab a pen and paper and stick a note reading, “This book is plagiarized” inside the covers.

    Me too! With a post it note!

    *raises hand* is it really bad form that i have been doing this, and get a gleeful little thrill when i do? *g* there’s a barnes and noble in a little town in california’s central valley whose employees, at least once every couple of months, have to go through the romance aisle, find the scattered cassie edwards novels (i at least don’t take them out of the romance section), turn them spine out, and remove post-its that say “plagiarist”, “thief”, “these words are stolen”, “not an original work”, “based on-no, wait is someone else’s story” and “what about the ferrets?”.

    i try to keep it down, cause it’s “my” store, and i like shopping there and like the employees and don’t want to cause too much extra work for them. i wouldn’t want to get caught at it, but i’m almost hoping i do so i can enlighten them as to the reason. i also engage anyone i see picking up a cassie edwards novel while i’m browsing, and tell them why they don’t want to spend their money on it.

    i guess my actions could be called “mean” and “hounding”, but-wait!- no, nevermind. thought i felt a twinge of sympathy there, but it was just gas. 🙂

    spamword: hair79 why yes, my hair has been approximately 79 different colors. i’m telling you bitches, this thing is eerie!

  15. i wouldn’t want to get caught at it, but i’m almost hoping i do so i can enlighten them as to the reason.

    Wouldnn’t it just be easier to tell them what your issue is? And how much it bothers you as a customer to see what they’re stocking?

    Seems to me your actions are pestering the wrong people, and only creating a nuisance. Edwards is the problem, not the book store staff.

  16. Grrrly says:

    Wouldnn’t it just be easier to tell them what your issue is? And how much it bothers you as a customer to see what they’re stocking?

    Seems to me your actions are pestering the wrong people, and only creating a nuisance. Edwards is the problem, not the book store staff.

    the bookstore staff rarely has any say in what the store stocks, especially a big chain like b&n;. which is why i email corporate monthly doing exactly what you suggest, and telling them why they shouldn’t stock this author. and there again, big chain store, not much effect.
    as much as “pestering” the staff, whom i’ve overheard being pleasantly bemused in their speculation, i think my actions cut right to the source, causing whoever finds and picks up that edwards novel to wonder what the deal is, and thus potentially robbing her of an easy sale. and i’m all about not lining the pockets of a thief. you protest this your way, i’ll do it mine.

  17. I did know about CE, JD, but not about Jennifer Crusie. I won’t be buying anything by her again, despite having really loved (and got another friend to buy as well!) Agnes and the Hitman.

    I thought I’d been following this thread OK, but now I’m wondering if I missed something. Jennifer Crusie hasn’t plagiarised anything. I do remember that she made a comment in 2008, in response to the plagiarism allegations against Cassie Edwards, which was controversial. If you’re referring to that, have you also seen her post over at her own blog? She explained there that she felt she’d expressed herself very badly at

    a blog that does very good reporting and reviewing, albeit savagely with a strong undercurrent of S&D;[snide and demean]. This site has one author that it returns to regularly to hold up for ridicule. It’s the only thing about this site that I don’t like, but I’ve never said anything. And that’s where I screwed up. I should have said something. I should not have sat at home with my laptop and watched the repeated humiliation of this author without saying, “What did she do to you guys, run over your dog?” Then they posted comparisons of her work with non-fiction sources, and it appears clear that she lifted her information word-for-word from those sources which is plagiarism. Normally, I’d have said, “She goes down;” plagiarism is serious and rampant in our industry, and any time we can make the point that it’s wrong, we should. But I read it and thought, “Are they ever going to leave this woman alone?” and posted the run-over-your-dog comment, which was taken as a refutation that plagiarism is a serious thing, and which I deserved because I was, once again, going for snide-and-derision instead of making myself clear. So I went back in and said, “Plagiarism is bad, but what you’re doing to his author is a crime, too,” or words to that effect. Then I left the site. Haven’t been back since. Not going back. Because while it’s a great site by smart passionate women who love romance, I don’t like the S&D;there. I wish them the best, but I’m not their reader, which I’m sure has been pointed out in the comments by now, several times, loudly.

    and Candy contributed to the comments thread, and gave her point of view:

    When you posted your running-over-our-dog comment, notice how I didn’t jump all over your ass. I laughed, and agreed that yeah, Edwards has been our pinata for a while, and I even felt kind of bad about it. See, if people point out something about me, I’ll cop to it if I think they have a point–otherwise I’ll argue the crap out of it, because you can take a girl out of Debate Team, but you can’t take the Debate Team out of the girl. You and Rich and all the other people who’ve felt oogy about the way we’ve treated Edwards have every right to feel oogy and every right to tell us we’re being cruel. You’re right. I’ve been a stone-cold mean-ass bitch about the Cassie Edwards novels. Do I think I’m justified in saying what I’ve said about them in the past? To be honest: Yes. (I don’t think people who haven’t read them can understand. Which sounds obnoxious, like we’re some sort of sorority with some kind of hazing requirement, but I don’t know how else to put it.) Will I stop now? Yes, but not because I’m a penitent stone-cold mean-ass bitch, but because once it became clear to me just how pervasive the unattributed usage issue was, it stopped being funny. It stopped being about bad taste and it started becoming a ethical issue. Bad taste = funny. Ethics? Not so much.

  18. Becky says:

    I did know about CE, JD, but not about Jennifer Crusie. I won’t be buying anything by her again, despite having really loved (and got another friend to buy as well!) Agnes and the Hitman.

    How did Crusie get into this conversation?  I know she posted something within hours of the story breaking, basically saying “why are you picking on Edwards again?”  (And I have to admit, my first reaction that day, before I understood the situation, was “another post about Cassie Edwards?”  She was the regular butt of jokes around here before the plagiarism was revealed.)  Lumping her in with Edwards and Dailey implies that she is a plagiarist.  As far as I know, no one has ever made that claim.  If you take offense at her reaction that’s fine, but please be careful when you group people together.  Plagiarism and disagreeing with the popular opinion are two very different sins.

  19. michelle says:

    Sorry I lost all respect for Jennifer Crusie with her blog posts.  Basically she can dish it out and it is “funny”, but others are being snide and mean.  She tried to shift the focus off plagerism being a serious issues to those mean girls. 

    Also it was just sickening that some of CE fans were taking potshots at Nora Roberts.  She has always been the epitome of professionalism. 

    Plagerism disrespects the reader by its dishonesty.  It is a slap in the face to the victim and the readers.  Anyone who supports plagerism shows the same disrespect for the reader-it’s like giving the reader the middle finger.  How can people respect the romance community if large portions can’t respect themselves?

  20. Morgana says:

    Is there a wee bit of the green eyed monster taking over? Would people be as angry if Cassie Edwards was not the author of a zillion books. Just putting that out there.

    Also I do think that it is wrong to copy other peoples work (Of course this is a no brainer) but as far as the other authors needing to be compensated or feeling hard done by. Who are these other authors? Were they romance writers or even in a genre likely to be read by CE readers.

    No one has ever ripped off my work (shocking I know) but if they did I would a) be ever so pleased that someone other than my mother and advisor read my work and b) want to send the offender a list of writers far better than me to steal from.

    And another minor point, she was not stealing plots or even scenes from other writers. She took research about tribes and used it without citing it but as a fiction writer is she expected to provide a work cited page?

  21. Anon76 says:

    Yeah, I totally agree that Crusie should not be brought up in this discussion.

    She voiced her opinion, nothing more, nothing less. That I personally disagree with said opinion does not make her a “bad guy” in my eyes.

  22. She tried to shift the focus off plagerism {sic} being a serious issues to those mean girls.

    That was pretty much my objection to Crusie – attacking the whistleblowers is low, and gives comfort to those who want to sweep this under the carpet. Everything I’ve read of Crusie since then about this, has been all about her and how painful it’s been for her to be upbraided for her behaviour. An industry professional of her stature should just damn well have known better, and at the first hint the story was about plagiarism, she should have shut up until she had the facts, if she couldn’t say something more constructive.

  23. Kismet says:

    The problem as I see it, is that there is no across the board consequence for a writer who plagiarizes the works of another. If each publishing house and writers association took an official stand against plagiarism and codified rule and consequences for such actions (losing existing contracts, fines, and non-membership for X number of years for example) then perhaps these things would not happen. Ok, that is wishful thinking, but at least then they can’t wail “but I didn’t know it was wrong”, they will only wail “But I should be the exception” ( I work in retail and have no faith in humanity anymore… can you tell I just came out of the Xmas shopping season?).

    In the meantime… (and certainly not to excuse plagiarism) I wonder if this may have been more common amongst writers of a certain era? Think about it… how many older books have you read and thought “gee, I think I’ve heard (sentence, story line, etc) before”, but had no idea where. I am left wondering if this may have been more of an issue, but until the advent (and common usage) of the internet there was really no way of searching through every book until you found the common thread. Certainly not to say it was ever right, but merely that they never thought they would be caught.

    In an after thought, how do writers handle the following situation: Say you are in the midst of a WIP, peacefully minding your own business, when you open a review page (or the book, or another authors website). All of a sudden you realize that there are some shocking similarities in your work with this other work (names, or character personalities, situations, maybe even a similar sentence)… What do you do? It’s simply a curious question.

  24. Anon76 says:

    Sigh,

    Morgana, you are just determined that this kind of theft is a compliment to the original author.

    I wish you the absolute best in your writing career, and also hope that someday you don’t rue your own words when someone steals your work. The grass is always a bit greener (or sere)  from the other side of the fence.

  25. As for the seriousness of this situation, perhaps a bit of perspective is in order.

    I’m curious as to which perspective you want.  She should be all forgiven because she’s in ill health? SBTB should apologize?

    No to both counts. If Cassie Edwards’ ill health is stress-related, it is unfortunate but such is life.

  26. Is there a wee bit of the green eyed monster taking over? Would people be as angry if Cassie Edwards was not the author of a zillion books.

    That she only wrote half of.

    Puhlease, Morgana. You sound like a plagiarism apologist’s bingo card.

    No, we’re not jealous. No, plagiarism isn’t flattery (what, are you insane?) Yes, it’s important. And no, it doesn’t make a difference if the ripped off authors were romance authors or not (what, are you insane?)

    She took research about tribes and used it without citing it but as a fiction writer is she expected to provide a work cited page?

    She took research and copied it verbatim. That’s not ‘using’, that’s stealing.

    Tell me, have you got any formal education at all? Because if you have and don’t understand what she did, then you just weren’t paying attention in class.

  27. michelle says:

    Aack, sorry I spelled plagiarism wrong-I tried to go back and edit but I just got invalid edit as a response.  Drat.

  28. Anon76 says:

    Kismet asked,

    “In an after thought, how do writers handle the following situation: Say you are in the midst of a WIP, peacefully minding your own business, when you open a review page (or the book, or another authors website). All of a sudden you realize that there are some shocking similarities in your work with this other work (names, or character personalities, situations, maybe even a similar sentence)… What do you do? It’s simply a curious question.”

    Well, first off. the “reality” is their are very few “new” stories. Most revolve around basic plot lines around for Milleniums.

    However, a simple sentence you find familiar to your own work in progress isn’t big warning signs. I’m sure authors have pulled here and there a version of the scene with “Play it again, Sam”. Or whatever the original line is.

    The real problem is when you pull more than just similarities, but verbatim paragraphs and what not. If that is what you this is what a person sees in his/her WIP, and it’s on another writers site, then you have to evaluate two things:

    1) Did you copy the text verbatim with the intent to label it as your own? (Any writer will tell you that the thought and characters for a story can be written all over the board with only those things. That no two people will write them the same unless in partnership.)

    or 2) The story online or published has verbatim portions from your WIP in it and you were on crit groups, shared it somehow, or what not. However, you do have your original dated files to show that you have officially been ripped off verbatim.

    These pose two very different scenarios

  29. Anon76 says:

    Crud,

    Should have edited my last post. Oh well, time for dinner rather than chewing on this again.

  30. Lori S. says:

    Is there a wee bit of the green eyed monster taking over? Would people be as angry if Cassie Edwards was not the author of a zillion books. Just putting that out there.

    *headdesk*

    Exactly what part of THEFT do you not understand, Morgana?  Do we need to pull out the sock puppets?

  31. Morgana says:

    Tell me, have you got any formal education at all? Because if you have and don’t understand what she did, then you just weren’t paying attention in class.

    Yes I do have an education, complete with all sorts of letters after my name. What about you? But even if I was a high school drop out I would not resort to calling people names if they did not agree with me.

    What do you do for a living? Are you a frustrated writer by any chance?

  32. Madd says:

    As for the seriousness of this situation, perhaps a bit of perspective is in order.

    What’s the perspective? That it’s just a romance novel? Just a book? Just a few words? Nothing to give someone a hard time about?

    When I was 5 years old I stole a pack of Rolos from a store. My mom realized this when she was loading us in the car. She chastised me and walked me back into the store and made me go up to the register by myself, return it, and apologize for taking it. I remember I was really scared about going up to the man and admitting what I did. I was bawling the whole time, but I learned the lesson and never did it again.

    If my mother saw things from the perspective that Cassie Edwards fans seems to view plagiarism, not only would she have spared me the lesson, she would have let me have the chocolate. After all, I was just a little girl.

    The fact is that she stole other people’s work. Someone else spent time, energy, and money to research their subjects and then put the effort into their writing. It’s not just about sentences artfully strung together. It’s about someone profiting, without so much as a nod, from something you put your resources, maybe even bits of yourself, into.

  33. Yes I do have an education, complete with all sorts of letters after my name.

    Well, either you’re lying, or you bought the qualifications, because no one who went through really truly education could fail to understand what plagiarism is or how serious it is.

    As for me, I am [real name redacted] BA, BSc (Hons I), MSc. If you had clicked on the link under my name on the comment, you would see I *am* a writer – and a published one. So, not frustrated at all, thanks. And my other job is web/database developer, where I have to be careful not to use other people’s code without attribution because, duh, that’s *theft*.

    But maybe you went to those *special* schools where you didn’t learn about any of those things, and students could copy and paste to their heart’s content and no one would ever care. I’m sure your advisor would be absolutely thrilled to hear you standing up against the raging forces of public opinion to defend a unrepentant thief.

  34. Suze says:

    And another minor point, she was not stealing plots or even scenes from other writers. She took research about tribes and used it without citing it but as a fiction writer is she expected to provide a work cited page?

    Hey, Susan Johnson did.

    As a fiction writer, she’s expected to work her research findings into her story in her own words.

    Plagiarism:

    Sarah realized that January 2009 would mark a year since the plagiarism scandal that rocked the ferret world, as well as the romance world, so she asked Jane to examine the issue and do a “State of Plagiarism” analysis, so to speak. After much back and forth dialogue, we’ve come to the following conclusions about the way the issue of plagiarism is treated by our community.

    Using someone else’s idea in my own work:

    It has been a wild and wonderful year since ferrets everywhere (not to mention their romantic fans) were shocked black-footed by the discovery that best-selling author Cassie Edwards had repeatedly plagiarized her research sources.  In honour of this august anniversary, Sarah and Jane are presenting the results of their plagiariffic ruminations to readers of both their blogs.

  35. Madd says:

    She took research about tribes and used it without citing it but as a fiction writer is she expected to provide a work cited page?

    I quote to your from an article written by Paul Tolme, a journalist she stole from:

    It’s just a family of ferrets. Phew. Let’s put aside for now that ferrets live on the prairie, where there are no bushes—never mind the forest where Edwards has set her characters. Seeing the cute animals, Shiona and Shadow Bear launch into a discussion about the cute little critters.

    “They are so named because of their dark legs,” Shadow Bear says, to which Shiona responds: “They are so small, surely weighing only about two pounds and measuring two feet from tip to tail.”

    Shiona then tells Shadow Bear how she once read about ferrets in a book she took from the study of her father. “I discovered they are related to minks and otters. It is said their closest relations are European ferrets and Siberian polecats,” she says. “Researchers theorize that polecats crossed the land bridge that once linked Siberia and Alaska, to establish the New World population.”

    Ohmygod that is so hot.

    Shadow Bear responds: “What I have observed of them, myself, is that these tiny animals breed in early spring when the males roam the night in search of females.” As the ferrets bound off into some distant bushes, he continues: “Mothers typically give birth to three kits in early summer and raise their young alone in abandoned prairie dog burrows.”

    Shiona: “I read that ferrets stalk and kill prairie dogs during the night. Using their keen sense of smell and whiskers to guide them through pitch-black burrows, ferrets suffocate the sleeping prey, an impressive feat considering the two species are about the same weight.” Shiona shivers, upset by the thought of the cute animals locked in mortal combat.
    Quantcast

    Sensing her vulnerability, Shadow Bear knows just what to say: “In turn, coyotes, badgers, and owls prey on ferrets, whose life span in the wild is often less than two winters … They have a short, quick life.”

    and later in the article:

    “Black-footed ferrets, so-named because of their dark legs, weigh about two pounds and measure two feet from tip to tail. Related to mink and otters, they are North America’s only native ferret (and a different species than the ferrets kept as pets). Their closest relatives are European ferrets and Siberian polecats. Researchers theorize polecats crossed the land bridge that once linked Siberia and Alaska to establish the New World population. The animals breed in March and April, when males roam the night in search of females. Mothers typically give birth to three kits in June, and raise their young alone in abandoned prairie dog burrows.

    “Ferrets stalk and kill prairie dogs during the night. Using their keen sense of smell and whiskers to guide them through pitch-black burrows, ferrets clamp a suffocation bite on their sleeping prey—an impressive feat, considering that the two species are about the same weight. Coyotes, badgers and owls in turn prey on ferrets, whose lifespan in the wild is often less than two years. ‘It’s a tough and quick life,’ Livieri says.”

    Edwards even has Shadow Bear mouth the quote by Livieri—who is a nice guy but by no means a loincloth-wearing love machine. I called Edwards at her home in Mattoon, Ill., and reached her husband, who told me neither would make any statements about the situation based on the advice of an attorney and editors.

  36. Ruth says:

    I refuse to believe that anyone that’s been through any level of higher education believes that it would peachy keen and awful flattering for someone else to steal their work product.

    Does not compute.

  37. morgana says:

    Not to get into a pissing contest Ann but what Uni did you go to?

  38. what Uni did you go to?

    University of Queensland, Australia
    Open University, UK
    Kingston University, UK

    Now pony up with the amazing universities *you* went to, and the degrees, which makes you such an authority on the insignificance of plagiarism.

    You are, of course, making this ad hominem because you don’t have a leg to stand on.

  39. Madd says:

    Why is it that when anyone says “Not to make this a pissing match …” my brain insists on adding “Ooops, sorry, was that your leg?”

  40. Why exactly has this become a my degree is better than yours battle?  Irrelevant.  Let’s stick to the issue of plagiarism and stay away from all of the ego stroking stuff.

Comments are closed.

By posting a comment, you consent to have your personally identifiable information collected and used in accordance with our privacy policy.

↑ Back to Top